Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens

[Dave M]

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

This model seems to be big enough to handle all the boards that I want to
make, so that is a plus. Just wondering if this model produces good boards
with no unsoldered areas, damaged components, etc. If it can consistently
produce good boards, I'll take a chance on one of them. Reading the
Chinglish instructions is scary enough , but maybe I can figure it out well
enough to make it work.

Hope someone can give good advice

Dave M

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, "Dave M" <dgminala@mediacombb.net>
wrote:

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

With solder paste, if you misalign the component slightly, when the
solder reflows, it will magically float into the proper position.

>Hope someone can give good advice

If you Google for "toaster oven reflow contoller":
<https://www.google.com/search?q=toaster+oven+reflow+controller>
You'll find a variety of articles on how to modify a toaster oven into
a workable reflow oven. For example, here's a list of possible kits:
<https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/favorite-diy-reflow-toaster-oven-controllers/>
Here's my version which I use mostly to reflow chronically defective
HP Jetdirect network cards:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/repair/BGA%20reflow/index.html>


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Gerhard Hoffmann]

Am 08.10.2017 um 22:40 schrieb Dave M:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

This model seems to be big enough to handle all the boards that I want to
make, so that is a plus. Just wondering if this model produces good boards
with no unsoldered areas, damaged components, etc. If it can consistently
produce good boards, I'll take a chance on one of them. Reading the
Chinglish instructions is scary enough , but maybe I can figure it out well
enough to make it work.

Hope someone can give good advice

I have one of these:

< https://eleshop.eu/vapour-phase-mini-condens-it.html >

Bought it when the manufacturer did not yet have distributors,
at a somewhat smaller price.

Vapor phase is a completely different game.



I'm still trying to recover from the "English manuals" of
< http://www.ebay.de/itm/112168145773?ul_noapp=true >,
which is a Locky_Z curve tracer:

I got some results for JFETs:

Some IF3602 pairs:
<
https://www.flickr.com/photos/137684711@N07/37321004540/in/dateposted-public/
>

Some of the new ones from ON, e.a.:
<
https://www.flickr.com/photos/137684711@N07/36909661793/in/dateposted-public/
>

I had no luck so far with 2N2222. Probably they oscillate happily on the
tracer and need base stoppers.


cheers, Gerhard

 

[Neon John]

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, "Dave M" <dgminala@mediacombb.net>
wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My concern (mainly because I have no experience with infrared) is that
the black chips and components would get hot faster than the shiny
pins and solder paste.

I have an oven that I built using a tabletop convection oven and a
programmable timer. It works great but it's using hot air to do the
heating.

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

The neat thing about reflow is that if you put the proper amount of
paste on each pad, the surface tension of the solder will pull the
part or chip in line with the pads.

I've developed an unconventional technique for pasting 0.5 mm pin
spaced ICs. I put the chip on its back and use my pressure/vacuum
paste dispenser to lay a solid stream across each side of the chip.

I then hold the chip with some pliers while I wipe the other side with
a Q-tip. This removes paste between the pins. Drop the chip in
place, populate the rest of the board and reflow. Both my vision and
my steadiness of hand have declined over the past few years and this
is how I compensated.

This model seems to be big enough to handle all the boards that I want to
make, so that is a plus. Just wondering if this model produces good boards
with no unsoldered areas, damaged components, etc. If it can consistently
produce good boards, I'll take a chance on one of them. Reading the
Chinglish instructions is scary enough , but maybe I can figure it out well
enough to make it work.

That thing is cheap enough that if I didn't already have an oven, I'd
buy one just to test it. It would hurt only a little to bin it if it
didn't work.

John

John DeArmond
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.tnduction.com
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
See website for email address

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, "Dave M" <dgminala@mediacombb.net>
wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

Original Chinese web page:
<http://www.tech168.cn/a/chanpinzhanshi/huiliuhanji/2013110256.html>
Looks like it's still in production.

T962A SMD Reflow Oven Fix/Hack
<http://www.instructables.com/id/T962A-SMD-Reflow-Oven-FixHack/>

Maintaining a list of T962/T962A problems, improvements and
suggestions how to get good results #76
<https://github.com/UnifiedEngineering/T-962-improvements/issues/76>

Modifying the T-962 Reflow Oven
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ITZXY5Mipc>

More videos:
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMwRdEi0iPg>
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zj1qn476k9o>
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IgPMvaY8ibQ>
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JH8Qd1vv768>
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cP2SYn7XFl4>


--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[John Larkin]

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, "Dave M" <dgminala@mediacombb.net>
wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

My vision has always been mediocre, and it's not improving with age.
(The retina detach didn't help, either, but that's mostly fixed now.)
I got a compact Mantis on ebay and it totally changed my attitude
about SMT. I was replacing some 0603 resistors yesterday and the
optics was no problem.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wlim2da8cv9q6fj/Bench_Mantis.jpg?raw=1

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fp88o2rqgr87g9d/Mantis2.JPG?raw=1

The imaging is startling, and there's enough working distance for
soldering or probing. Or Dremeling.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7bihbjbaojvta0z/Z382_1.JPG?raw=1

When you can really see what you are doing, steadiness improves too.

As people have noted, a convection oven may be all you need for
reflow.


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

lunatic fringe electronics

 

[Joe Chisolm]

On Sun, 08 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, Dave M wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

This model seems to be big enough to handle all the boards that I want to
make, so that is a plus. Just wondering if this model produces good boards
with no unsoldered areas, damaged components, etc. If it can consistently
produce good boards, I'll take a chance on one of them. Reading the
Chinglish instructions is scary enough , but maybe I can figure it out well
enough to make it work.

Hope someone can give good advice

Dave M

I have one and it works OK. I've done hundreds of boards through it over
the years. The instructions are typical chopped up English but understandable
and there are vidoes on the net you can watch. It's bulky. You really need about
24in x 24 in work space with good ventlation. No problem doing 2 sided boards.

You can program custom profiles and depending on the paste my need one. The
profiles can be hard to setup. It does an OK job following the profile but
if you hold a temp too long (say board soak) and then try and ramp up the
hold temp will fall below at the end and then over shoot on the up hill side. Once
you get the profile set correctly it will do a OK job.


Do not expect to fill it to the edge with a board. You will not get good soldering
at the edges if you do. I think it's 300×320mm max but you really need to think
in the 280x300mm range max.

If you are only doing a few boards once in a while use the hotplate method. The
T962 is big and heavy and will just be collecting dust and in the way. But if you
have the room it will work fine for you.

Remember you are gonna need paste. I've had good luck with these guys

http://www.chipquik.com/store/

--
Chisolm
Republic of Texas

 

[bitrex]

On 10/08/2017 05:54 PM, Neon John wrote:

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, "Dave M" <dgminala@mediacombb.net
wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My concern (mainly because I have no experience with infrared) is that
the black chips and components would get hot faster than the shiny
pins and solder paste.

I have an oven that I built using a tabletop convection oven and a
programmable timer. It works great but it's using hot air to do the
heating.

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

The neat thing about reflow is that if you put the proper amount of
paste on each pad, the surface tension of the solder will pull the
part or chip in line with the pads.

I've developed an unconventional technique for pasting 0.5 mm pin
spaced ICs. I put the chip on its back and use my pressure/vacuum
paste dispenser to lay a solid stream across each side of the chip.

I then hold the chip with some pliers while I wipe the other side with
a Q-tip. This removes paste between the pins. Drop the chip in
place, populate the rest of the board and reflow. Both my vision and
my steadiness of hand have declined over the past few years and this
is how I compensated.

Technique I've used occasionally that so far has always seemed to work
pretty good for soldering say 14 or 16 pin SOIC "surfboards":

Use regular soldering iron and thin 60/40 solder to tin the pads. Put
the IC down using tweezers and "tack" the top left and bottom right to
the board. Apply pressure on the center of the IC using a jeweler's
screwdriver with one hand (wear a protective glove!) while blasting the
pins on one side of the IC with hot air from a lightweight heat gun for
about 10 seconds, back and forth until you visibly see the solder on the
pads go shiny. Remove heat and hold for another 15 seconds or so, then
remove pressure and let cool for about a minute. Then repeat for the
other side.

Then continuity test from the junction of the pin and the package to the
hole on the board for the mounting hardware. Meter should beep just from
light contact without applying any pressure at all from the probe to the
pin. Sometimes there's one pin that didn't quite get a solid connection
and won't test for continuity without pushing down a bit, but a single
pin is easy to touch up by hand.

 

[Jon Elson]

Dave M wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using
the Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the
evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made
in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a
soldering iron steady enough to build the boards.

I have a toaster oven converted to a reflow oven with a ramp and soak
temperature controller. But, for one-offs, I do not use it.

To do manual assembly by reflow, first you need to apply solder paste to the
board, either dot by dot or with a stencil. Then, you need to apply ALL the
parts. If you just TOUCH the sufrace of the board, you will knock parts out
of alignment. I can't imagine placing dozens of parts with tweezers without
knocking them out of place. I do this with my pick and place machine, but I
just take the board off the P&P and straight into the oven, with no fiddling
around with the board. I really don't think this is a sane way to do SMT.

Using a good head-mounted magnifier (or better, a stereo zoom microscope!!)
you can easily place the parts and solder. I put a dab of solder on one pad
of each part location, tack the part down and then solder the other lead(s).
I've been doing this for years for one-offs, it is faster than through-hole.

Jon

 

On Mon, 9 Oct 2017 14:17:15 -0400, bitrex
<bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote:

On 10/08/2017 05:54 PM, Neon John wrote:
On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 15:40:58 -0500, "Dave M" <dgminala@mediacombb.net
wrote:

Anyone have any experience or have colleagues who have experience using the
Chinese-made reflow soldering ovens such as those being sold on the evil
auction place? The one I've looked at is item number:262955348183 (Model
T962).

My concern (mainly because I have no experience with infrared) is that
the black chips and components would get hot faster than the shiny
pins and solder paste.

I have an oven that I built using a tabletop convection oven and a
programmable timer. It works great but it's using hot air to do the
heating.

My eyes have become the major challenge to producing the one- or two-off
projects, since many of the parts that are available today are only made in
SMD packages. I realize that placing them onto the board still remains a
challenge, but at least with a proper oven, I won't have to hold a soldering
iron steady enough to build the boards.

The neat thing about reflow is that if you put the proper amount of
paste on each pad, the surface tension of the solder will pull the
part or chip in line with the pads.

I've developed an unconventional technique for pasting 0.5 mm pin
spaced ICs. I put the chip on its back and use my pressure/vacuum
paste dispenser to lay a solid stream across each side of the chip.

I then hold the chip with some pliers while I wipe the other side with
a Q-tip. This removes paste between the pins. Drop the chip in
place, populate the rest of the board and reflow. Both my vision and
my steadiness of hand have declined over the past few years and this
is how I compensated.

Technique I've used occasionally that so far has always seemed to work
pretty good for soldering say 14 or 16 pin SOIC "surfboards":

SOICs are a piece of cake. They're *huge*.

Use regular soldering iron and thin 60/40 solder to tin the pads. Put
the IC down using tweezers and "tack" the top left and bottom right to
the board. Apply pressure on the center of the IC using a jeweler's
screwdriver with one hand (wear a protective glove!) while blasting the
pins on one side of the IC with hot air from a lightweight heat gun for
about 10 seconds, back and forth until you visibly see the solder on the
pads go shiny. Remove heat and hold for another 15 seconds or so, then
remove pressure and let cool for about a minute. Then repeat for the
other side.

Remove all solder from all of the pins except one, then tack that pin
down and position the part. Go around and solder the rest. Yes, I
always use leaded solder (being careful to remove all of the socialist
solder from all pads).

Then continuity test from the junction of the pin and the package to the
hole on the board for the mounting hardware. Meter should beep just from
light contact without applying any pressure at all from the probe to the
pin. Sometimes there's one pin that didn't quite get a solid connection
and won't test for continuity without pushing down a bit, but a single
pin is easy to touch up by hand.

Your soldering technique needs work if you have to test continuity.