Cerberus heatwave threatens new record temperatures for Europe...

[Fred Bloggs]

Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Even the dullest among them can realize they\'ve burned themselves out of house and home. Makes no difference what they realize. Nothing can be done at this point.

Some really startling news is El Nino is so powerful this year, there may not be a winter.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/southern-europe-swelters-cerberus-heatwave-bites-2023-07-13/

 

[Carlos E.R.]

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:

Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.

Even the dullest among them can realize they\'ve burned themselves out of house and home. Makes no difference what they realize. Nothing can be done at this point.

Some really startling news is El Nino is so powerful this year, there may not be a winter.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/southern-europe-swelters-cerberus-heatwave-bites-2023-07-13/

--
Cheers, Carlos.

 

[John Larkin]

On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\"
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.

I guess a big black parking lot qualifies as \"parts of Spain.\"

Sattelites have better thermal-imaging resolution than they had 100
years ago.

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:

On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\"
robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.
I guess a big black parking lot qualifies as \"parts of Spain.\"

Satellites have better thermal-imaging resolution than they had 100
years ago.

The only satellite in orbit in 1923 was the moon, and we didn\'t have any thermal imaging cameras up there back then.

The atmospheric CO2 level on 1923 was about 305 ppm

https://sealevel.info/co2.html

which is a bit above the 270 ppm which is typical of an interglacial but not enough to move surface temperatures out of the noise band you get from ocean currents moving around.

This is just the usual climate change denial propaganda line of ignoring what we do now about past temperatures and dreaming up ways in which old-fashioned measurements could be misleading. It\'s transparent nonsense but gullible twits like John Larkin fall for it.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[a a]

On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 14:06:48 UTC+2, Fred Bloggs wrote:

Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Even the dullest among them can realize they\'ve burned themselves out of house and home. Makes no difference what they realize. Nothing can be done at this point.

Some really startling news is El Nino is so powerful this year, there may not be a winter.

El Nino is delusional fake

 

[a a]

On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\"
robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.
I guess a big black parking lot qualifies as \"parts of Spain.\"

Satellites have better thermal-imaging resolution than they had 100
years ago.

The only satellite in orbit in 1923 was the moon, and we didn\'t have any thermal imaging cameras up there back then.

The atmospheric CO2 level on 1923 was about 305 ppm

https://sealevel.info/co2.html

which is a bit above the 270 ppm which is typical of an interglacial but not enough to move surface temperatures out of the noise band you get from ocean currents moving around.

This is just the usual climate change denial propaganda line of ignoring what we do now about past temperatures and dreaming up ways in which old-fashioned measurements could be misleading. It\'s transparent nonsense but gullible twits like John Larkin fall for it.

daily delusional CO2 level ideas by moron from Sydney

\\//././

The only greenhouse gas is H2O in vapour state

Read R&D papers by 2021 Water cycle Nobelist from Japan first

CO2 has never been a greenhouse gas, which matters

Climate Changes is an ancient tautology by Heraclitus

Everything flows
Panta rhei

due to fluctuations in solar activity

 

[a a]

>

Darius the Dumb has posted yet one more #veryStupidByLowIQaa article.

 

[a a]

>

Yet one more #veryStupidByLowIQaa post.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:

On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\"
robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.
I guess a big black parking lot qualifies as \"parts of Spain.\"

Satellites have better thermal-imaging resolution than they had 100
years ago.

The only satellite in orbit in 1923 was the moon, and we didn\'t have any thermal imaging cameras up there back then.

The atmospheric CO2 level on 1923 was about 305 ppm

https://sealevel.info/co2.html

which is a bit above the 270 ppm which is typical of an interglacial but not enough to move surface temperatures out of the noise band you get from ocean currents moving around.

This is just the usual climate change denial propaganda line of ignoring what we do now about past temperatures and dreaming up ways in which old-fashioned measurements could be misleading. It\'s transparent nonsense but gullible twits like John Larkin fall for it.

daily delusional CO2 level ideas by moron from Sydney

\\//././

The only greenhouse gas is H2O in vapour state

Water vapor is a greenhouse gas, so you\'re right about that. But it doesn\'t trap much heat because it rains out of the atmosphere. Now that the atmosphere is slightly warmer, the air will hold slightly more water vapor and be slightly better at trapping heat. But it\'s still insignificant compared to CO2 and its heat trapping. CO2 is a powerhouse heat trapping gas, and that is easily demonstrated. It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.

Read R&D papers by 2021 Water cycle Nobelist from Japan first

CO2 has never been a greenhouse gas, which matters

It\'s the most basic form of physics. A very direct and single layer of measurement. It\'s the absolute simplest aspect of atmospheric physics to prove.

Climate Changes is an ancient tautology by Heraclitus

Heraclitus wasn\'t talking about climate change.

Everything flows
Panta rhei

due to fluctuations in solar activity

 

[server]

On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 05:06:42 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:

>Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is sunlit ground temperatures, not official temperature
measurements in the shadow.

>That is a big YIKES.

60 C is just a cold sauna . Not really a problem as long as the air
is dry (wet bulb temperature below 30 C) and you have enough to drink.

One summer in the 1980\'s I worked in Saudi-Arabia with day
temperatures above 45 C, you just had to stay indoors during the day.
In the morning from the air conditioned apartment with an air
conditioned car to the air conditioned office and back in the
afternoon.

The main problem was the flimsy walls, doors and windows that leaked
heat inside and the air condition had to run all the time at full
power. That 24/7 air condition noise for weeks is quite annoying and
the only way to get a quiet time was to take a walk inn the desert
before sunrise, in which the air temperature was 25 C.



In countries with a hot climate the building code should require well
insulated walls, double/triple glazed windows and good doors, which
significantly reduce air condition needs and hence noise.

Local solar panels are also a good idea, since it reduces network
loading during peak hours and also provide some cooling help if the
network crashes due to overloading.

Outdoor activities should be concentrated to night or sunrise hours.

 

[Mike Monett VE3BTI]

upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

The main problem was the flimsy walls, doors and windows that leaked
heat inside and the air condition had to run all the time at full
power. That 24/7 air condition noise for weeks is quite annoying and
the only way to get a quiet time was to take a walk inn the desert
before sunrise, in which the air temperature was 25 C.

Get an air conditioner with a scroll compressor. Ultra quiet and energy
efficient. Google for it.



--
MRM

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:30:04 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:
On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\"
robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.
I guess a big black parking lot qualifies as \"parts of Spain.\"

Satellites have better thermal-imaging resolution than they had 100
years ago.

The only satellite in orbit in 1923 was the moon, and we didn\'t have any thermal imaging cameras up there back then.

The atmospheric CO2 level on 1923 was about 305 ppm

https://sealevel.info/co2.html

which is a bit above the 270 ppm which is typical of an interglacial but not enough to move surface temperatures out of the noise band you get from ocean currents moving around.

This is just the usual climate change denial propaganda line of ignoring what we do now about past temperatures and dreaming up ways in which old-fashioned measurements could be misleading. It\'s transparent nonsense but gullible twits like John Larkin fall for it.

daily delusional CO2 level ideas by moron from Sydney

\\//././

The only greenhouse gas is H2O in vapour state.

Water vapor is a greenhouse gas, so you\'re right about that. But it doesn\'t trap much heat because it rains out of the atmosphere.

It is a more important greenhouse gas than CO2, at least at the moment. It does freeze out of the atmosphere as you go higher and the air gets cooler, so it never pushes the effective radiating altitude up to where the air is really cool. The tropopause is at about -60 Celcius ( more less - it varies with latitude).

>Now that the atmosphere is slightly warmer, the air will hold slightly more water vapor and be slightly better at trapping heat.

That\'s not what is going on. It\'s not the temperature of the atmosphere the controls the water vapour content, but rather the temperature of the ocean surface underneath it. A warmer sea level surface has higher vapour pressure of water just above it, and that determines how much water vapour gets into the atmosphere to be spread around by air circulation.

>But it\'s still insignificant compared to CO2 and its heat trapping.

Wrong, It is a more important greenhouse gas than CO2, at least as things are at the moment

> CO2 is a powerhouse heat trapping gas, and that is easily demonstrated.

Do tell us how.

> It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.

During the ice ages CO2 levels ran around 180 ppm. An ice age may be a real climate problem but we\'ve survived several of them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleocene%E2%80%93Eocene_Thermal_Maximum

about 55 million years ago seems to be the last time CO2 levels were seriously elevated - \"a time period with a more than 5–8 °C global average temperature rise across the event\" which didnt kill off al that many land animals.

> > Read R&D papers by 2021 Water cycle Nobelist from Japan first

Where?

CO2 has never been a greenhouse gas, which matters.

It\'s the most basic form of physics. A very direct and single layer of measurement. It\'s the absolute simplest aspect of atmospheric physics to prove.

It did take a while to develop spectrometers with good enough spectral resolution for this to be demonstrable.

Climate Changes is an ancient tautology by Heraclitus

Heraclitus wasn\'t talking about climate change.

Everything flows Panta rhei

due to fluctuations in solar activity

Wrong. Solar activity doesn\'t explain the current warming.

https://climate.nasa.gov/faq/14/is-the-sun-causing-global-warming/

Climate change denial propaganda has picked out a few defective papers that have argued otherwise, but ignores the published refutations.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Carlos E.R.]

On 2023-07-15 11:49, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:

upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

The main problem was the flimsy walls, doors and windows that leaked
heat inside and the air condition had to run all the time at full
power. That 24/7 air condition noise for weeks is quite annoying and
the only way to get a quiet time was to take a walk inn the desert
before sunrise, in which the air temperature was 25 C.

Get an air conditioner with a scroll compressor. Ultra quiet and energy
efficient. Google for it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scroll_compressor

Curious. Never heard of it before not.

But I don\'t hear the compressor, it is in the outside wall. What I hear
is the fan inside the room when it is running at full power, which is
seldom. Inverter type.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 9:28:48 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:30:04 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:
On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\"
robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.

That is a big YIKES.

Notice that this is _ground_ temperature. These are not the standardized
temperatures used by weather agencies, which measure it a 1.20 meters
and in the shadow, significantly lower (record of around 45°C).

If you irradiate black asphalt it gets very hot, this is known. You
would have to compare that report with previous reports before getting
any conclusions.
I guess a big black parking lot qualifies as \"parts of Spain.\"

Satellites have better thermal-imaging resolution than they had 100
years ago.

The only satellite in orbit in 1923 was the moon, and we didn\'t have any thermal imaging cameras up there back then.

The atmospheric CO2 level on 1923 was about 305 ppm

https://sealevel.info/co2.html

which is a bit above the 270 ppm which is typical of an interglacial but not enough to move surface temperatures out of the noise band you get from ocean currents moving around.

This is just the usual climate change denial propaganda line of ignoring what we do now about past temperatures and dreaming up ways in which old-fashioned measurements could be misleading. It\'s transparent nonsense but gullible twits like John Larkin fall for it.

daily delusional CO2 level ideas by moron from Sydney

\\//././

The only greenhouse gas is H2O in vapour state.

Water vapor is a greenhouse gas, so you\'re right about that. But it doesn\'t trap much heat because it rains out of the atmosphere.
It is a more important greenhouse gas than CO2, at least at the moment. It does freeze out of the atmosphere as you go higher and the air gets cooler, so it never pushes the effective radiating altitude up to where the air is really cool. The tropopause is at about -60 Celcius ( more less - it varies with latitude).
Now that the atmosphere is slightly warmer, the air will hold slightly more water vapor and be slightly better at trapping heat.
That\'s not what is going on. It\'s not the temperature of the atmosphere the controls the water vapour content, but rather the temperature of the ocean surface underneath it. A warmer sea level surface has higher vapour pressure of water just above it, and that determines how much water vapour gets into the atmosphere to be spread around by air circulation.
But it\'s still insignificant compared to CO2 and its heat trapping.
Wrong, It is a more important greenhouse gas than CO2, at least as things are at the moment
CO2 is a powerhouse heat trapping gas, and that is easily demonstrated.
Do tell us how.
It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.
During the ice ages CO2 levels ran around 180 ppm. An ice age may be a real climate problem but we\'ve survived several of them.

What\'s this \'we\' stuff? You do notice the global population now stands at 8 billion and not 8 million. Living in a deep, moldy cave on a diet of mushroom and rodents may appeal to you, not me. An Ice Age is a climate problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleocene%E2%80%93Eocene_Thermal_Maximum

about 55 million years ago seems to be the last time CO2 levels were seriously elevated - \"a time period with a more than 5–8 °C global average temperature rise across the event\" which didnt kill off al that many land animals.
Read R&D papers by 2021 Water cycle Nobelist from Japan first
Where?

CO2 has never been a greenhouse gas, which matters.

It\'s the most basic form of physics. A very direct and single layer of measurement. It\'s the absolute simplest aspect of atmospheric physics to prove.
It did take a while to develop spectrometers with good enough spectral resolution for this to be demonstrable.
Climate Changes is an ancient tautology by Heraclitus

Heraclitus wasn\'t talking about climate change.

Everything flows Panta rhei

due to fluctuations in solar activity
Wrong. Solar activity doesn\'t explain the current warming.

https://climate.nasa.gov/faq/14/is-the-sun-causing-global-warming/

Climate change denial propaganda has picked out a few defective papers that have argued otherwise, but ignores the published refutations.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:04:17 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 9:28:48 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:30:04 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:
On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\" <robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:
On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:

<snip>

It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.

During the ice ages CO2 levels ran around 180 ppm. An ice age may be a real climate problem but we\'ve survived several of them.

What\'s this \'we\' stuff? You do notice the global population now stands at 8 billion and not 8 million. Living in a deep, moldy cave on a diet of mushroom and rodents may appeal to you, not me. An Ice Age is a climate problem.

It might be if we had one. That seems unlikely in the foreseeable future.

We aren\'t doing enough about anthropogenic global warming at the moment, but we are doing more than we were, and we will do a lot more as it gets more urgent.

We\'ve mastered the crucial trick, which is getting energy from renewable sources more cheaply than we can get it from burning fossil carbon.

The capital investment required to get enough renewable energy generation to let us dump all the fossil-carbon-fired legacy gear is large, and it\'s going to take while to happen, but we aren\'t going to end up living in damp caves on a diet of mushrooms and rodents - we never did (or at least not as a year round thing), and there\'s no reason to imagine that we will in the future.

Enjoy you alarmist fantasies, but don\'t expect to be taken seriously. You\'d have to have a better grasp of the facts for that to happen

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 5:09:11 AM UTC-4, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 05:06:42 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs
bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:

Satellite measurement of ground temperature in parts of Spain are at 60oC.
That is sunlit ground temperatures, not official temperature
measurements in the shadow.
That is a big YIKES.
60 C is just a cold sauna . Not really a problem as long as the air
is dry (wet bulb temperature below 30 C) and you have enough to drink.

It contributes to warming the air, similar to the heat island effect. The reason this is just now becoming a real problem is the substantial reduction of particulate air pollution, which was providing a shading effect.

One summer in the 1980\'s I worked in Saudi-Arabia with day
temperatures above 45 C, you just had to stay indoors during the day.
In the morning from the air conditioned apartment with an air
conditioned car to the air conditioned office and back in the
afternoon.

The main problem was the flimsy walls, doors and windows that leaked
heat inside and the air condition had to run all the time at full
power. That 24/7 air condition noise for weeks is quite annoying and
the only way to get a quiet time was to take a walk inn the desert
before sunrise, in which the air temperature was 25 C.



In countries with a hot climate the building code should require well
insulated walls, double/triple glazed windows and good doors, which
significantly reduce air condition needs and hence noise.

Of course, it\'s pointless to invest in expensive high efficiency equipment when the basic structure is flimsy and leaks.

In addition to flimsy construction, efficiency and comfort can be sabotaged by bad design, things like choosing the wrong orientation of the building is one example, there are plenty of others. You really want to keep windows to a minimum since even the best triple paned insulated types still come in at a paltry R-5. There are heat reflecting and insulating curtains that can be installed, but why have that expensive window when it has to have the curtain drawn all the time.

Local solar panels are also a good idea, since it reduces network
loading during peak hours and also provide some cooling help if the
network crashes due to overloading.

Outdoor activities should be concentrated to night or sunrise hours.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 9:29:38 AM UTC-4, Carlos E.R. wrote:

On 2023-07-15 11:49, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
upsid...@downunder.com wrote:

The main problem was the flimsy walls, doors and windows that leaked
heat inside and the air condition had to run all the time at full
power. That 24/7 air condition noise for weeks is quite annoying and
the only way to get a quiet time was to take a walk inn the desert
before sunrise, in which the air temperature was 25 C.

Get an air conditioner with a scroll compressor. Ultra quiet and energy
efficient. Google for it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scroll_compressor

Curious. Never heard of it before not.

But I don\'t hear the compressor, it is in the outside wall. What I hear
is the fan inside the room when it is running at full power, which is
seldom. Inverter type.

You mean the fan is running at its highest speed. That indicates so is the compressor. Your variable speed compressor is invariably highest speed all the time when it can\'t keep up with heat gain of the structure.

Have you checked your indoor temperature? Is the A/C regulating it, or is it slipping high?

--
Cheers, Carlos.

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 11:24:28 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:04:17 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 9:28:48 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:30:04 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:
On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\" <robin_...@es.invalid> wrote:
On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
snip
It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.

During the ice ages CO2 levels ran around 180 ppm. An ice age may be a real climate problem but we\'ve survived several of them.

What\'s this \'we\' stuff? You do notice the global population now stands at 8 billion and not 8 million. Living in a deep, moldy cave on a diet of mushroom and rodents may appeal to you, not me. An Ice Age is a climate problem.
It might be if we had one. That seems unlikely in the foreseeable future.

We aren\'t doing enough about anthropogenic global warming at the moment, but we are doing more than we were, and we will do a lot more as it gets more urgent.

We\'ve mastered the crucial trick, which is getting energy from renewable sources more cheaply than we can get it from burning fossil carbon.

The capital investment required to get enough renewable energy generation to let us dump all the fossil-carbon-fired legacy gear is large, and it\'s going to take while to happen, but we aren\'t going to end up living in damp caves on a diet of mushrooms and rodents - we never did (or at least not as a year round thing), and there\'s no reason to imagine that we will in the future.

Enjoy you alarmist fantasies, but don\'t expect to be taken seriously. You\'d have to have a better grasp of the facts for that to happen

You just keep memorizing factoids about trillion year old \"-ene\" periods and see what that gets you. It\'s not useful.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Anthony William Sloman]

On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:38:10 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 11:24:28 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:04:17 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 9:28:48 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:30:04 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:
On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\" <robin_....@es.invalid> wrote:
On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
snip
It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.

During the ice ages CO2 levels ran around 180 ppm. An ice age may be a real climate problem but we\'ve survived several of them.

What\'s this \'we\' stuff? You do notice the global population now stands at 8 billion and not 8 million. Living in a deep, moldy cave on a diet of mushroom and rodents may appeal to you, not me. An Ice Age is a climate problem.
It might be if we had one. That seems unlikely in the foreseeable future.

We aren\'t doing enough about anthropogenic global warming at the moment, but we are doing more than we were, and we will do a lot more as it gets more urgent.

We\'ve mastered the crucial trick, which is getting energy from renewable sources more cheaply than we can get it from burning fossil carbon.

The capital investment required to get enough renewable energy generation to let us dump all the fossil-carbon-fired legacy gear is large, and it\'s going to take while to happen, but we aren\'t going to end up living in damp caves on a diet of mushrooms and rodents - we never did (or at least not as a year round thing), and there\'s no reason to imagine that we will in the future.

Enjoy you alarmist fantasies, but don\'t expect to be taken seriously. You\'d have to have a better grasp of the facts for that to happen.

You just keep memorizing factoids about trillion year old \"-ene\" periods and see what that gets you. It\'s not useful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleocene%E2%80%93Eocene_Thermal_Maximum

It happened 55.5 million years ago. I don\'t have to bother memorising that - Wikipedia reminds me every time you make some half-witted assertion about what anthropgenic global warming is going to do to us. There\'s a lot that\'s uncertain, but nowhere near as much as you like to claim.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

 

[Fred Bloggs]

On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 11:58:20 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:

On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:38:10 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 11:24:28 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:04:17 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 9:28:48 AM UTC-4, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:30:04 AM UTC+10, Fred Bloggs wrote:
On Friday, July 14, 2023 at 2:03:07 PM UTC-4, a a wrote:
On Friday, 14 July 2023 at 18:15:47 UTC+2, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 1:27:21 AM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 14:24:54 +0200, \"Carlos E.R.\" <robin_....@es.invalid> wrote:
On 2023-07-14 14:06, Fred Bloggs wrote:
snip
It only takes a 100ppm more or less off optimum and you have real climate problems, which go either way too hot or too cold. PPM is a really scant presence, which should impress even the dullest person that CO2 is very powerful in that regard.

During the ice ages CO2 levels ran around 180 ppm. An ice age may be a real climate problem but we\'ve survived several of them.

What\'s this \'we\' stuff? You do notice the global population now stands at 8 billion and not 8 million. Living in a deep, moldy cave on a diet of mushroom and rodents may appeal to you, not me. An Ice Age is a climate problem.
It might be if we had one. That seems unlikely in the foreseeable future.

We aren\'t doing enough about anthropogenic global warming at the moment, but we are doing more than we were, and we will do a lot more as it gets more urgent.

We\'ve mastered the crucial trick, which is getting energy from renewable sources more cheaply than we can get it from burning fossil carbon.

The capital investment required to get enough renewable energy generation to let us dump all the fossil-carbon-fired legacy gear is large, and it\'s going to take while to happen, but we aren\'t going to end up living in damp caves on a diet of mushrooms and rodents - we never did (or at least not as a year round thing), and there\'s no reason to imagine that we will in the future.

Enjoy you alarmist fantasies, but don\'t expect to be taken seriously. You\'d have to have a better grasp of the facts for that to happen.

You just keep memorizing factoids about trillion year old \"-ene\" periods and see what that gets you. It\'s not useful.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleocene%E2%80%93Eocene_Thermal_Maximum

It happened 55.5 million years ago. I don\'t have to bother memorising that - Wikipedia reminds me every time you make some half-witted assertion about what anthropgenic global warming is going to do to us. There\'s a lot that\'s uncertain, but nowhere near as much as you like to claim.

The only difficulty here is finding someone who knows as little as you do about the subject.

Unbelievably, you only recently learned who is James Hansen, and then you dismissed the whole idea of Earth energy imbalance.

Michael Mann was interviewed today, and he is quite alarmed.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney