Can I use an APC UPS for DVDR and clock radios?

[mm]

I just got a used APC Back-UPS 300 and somewhere it says that it is
for computer equipment only and not for medical equipment.

I had hoped to use this for my heart-lung machine, but since I can't
do that, can I back up a Philips DVDR and a couple clock radios with
it, even though those are not computer equipment?


(Another weakness of the Philips 3576H DVDR is that it forgets all the
planned recording times if it's without power for more than a minute
or two.)

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:17:08 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

I just got a used APC Back-UPS 300 and somewhere it says that it is
for computer equipment only and not for medical equipment.

That's correct. It doesn't take much to create a ground loop with
your body in the circuit. The life you save may be your own. The
standard solution is to ground everything, which does not mean digging
a hole and burying everything in it. Fortunately, the APC Back-UPS
300 has a "site fault indicator", which will give you something to
think about as you bounce off the walls.

I had hoped to use this for my heart-lung machine,

Count Dracula did it better with just a coffin full of Transylvanian
dirt. No need for all that expensive technology.

but since I can't
do that, can I back up a Philips DVDR and a couple clock radios with
it, even though those are not computer equipment?

Yep. The only problem is that the Back-UPS series produces an ugly
modified sine wave, which means that the output waveform looks only
vaguely like a sine wave. That means you have lots of energy in the
harmonics of 60Hz. (A square wave has 1/3 of it's power in
harmonics). That won't cause too much trouble unless you have a badly
designed input filter, that turns these harmonics into heat.
Transformers also don't like harmonics. The easiest way is to try it.
If your equipment catches fire, it won't work.

(Another weakness of the Philips 3576H DVDR is that it forgets all the
planned recording times if it's without power for more than a minute
or two.)

That's normal. Older equipment tends to contract Alzheimers and
forget things. At this time, there's no cure, but I suspect you're on
the right track. A UPS should help with whatever problem you're
trying to solve that I already forgot.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[William R. Walsh]

Hi!

I had hoped to use this for my heart-lung machine

That is likely to be a phenomenally BAD idea. APC may only say that
for liability concerns, but there may be some very real safety and
performance issues to keep in mind.

can I back up a Philips DVDR and a couple clock radios with
it, even though those are not computer equipment?

For the Philips DVDR, *perhaps*. It's likely to use a switchmode power
supply same as a computer, and therefore it won't care too much.

The output of a cheap UPS such as this one is NASTY. It's usually a
squarewave or "stepped approximation to a sinewave". These low end APC
UPS units are the epitome of cheap UPS design. I do not know how they
do as well as they do.

There are two problems with the clock radios. First, practically every
one I have seen uses the powerline as a timing reference. If this
reference goes away (and they switch to an installed 9V backup
battery), it appears that the microcontroller keeps time based on an
internal timing loop. And from the looks of it, the stability of that
loop is pretty bad.

With a UPS providing the input, the timekeeping may go all over the
place.

There is another, more sinister problem, however. As your clock radios
are likely to be powered by a cheap transformer, that transformer may
very well overheat and burn out when running from a UPS that doesn't
output a true sine wave.

William

 

[PeterD]

On Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:17:08 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

I just got a used APC Back-UPS 300 and somewhere it says that it is
for computer equipment only and not for medical equipment.

I had hoped to use this for my heart-lung machine, but since I can't
do that, can I back up a Philips DVDR and a couple clock radios with
it, even though those are not computer equipment?


(Another weakness of the Philips 3576H DVDR is that it forgets all the
planned recording times if it's without power for more than a minute
or two.)

Can't see why not, they don't want the liability that medical
equipment carries.

In fact, I've got my iron lung hooked up to


a



computer UPS


But it


has


shutdown...

<gasp>

 

[William Sommerwerck]

The output of a cheap UPS such as this one is NASTY. It's
usually a squarewave or "stepped approximation to a sinewave".
These low end APC UPS units are the epitome of cheap UPS
design. I do not know how they do as well as they do.

They're cheap and they work. I've used APC * products for years, and never
had problems. The power goes out, and within milliseconds the SPS (it's not
a UPS) has taken over.

* APC also stands for aspirin-phenacetin-caffeine. Anacin used to have this
formulation, until it was discovered that pheacetin caused kidney damage.

 

[William R. Walsh]

Hi!

They're cheap and they work.

I never said that they didn't. I have several of them here, some on their
second battery. For what they are, they work well. I could not complain
about that.

And that's what I was getting at--they don't have any means by which to do a
periodic self test (other than at power on), and the only way they can
stabilize line voltage sags or surges is by going to battery. I had one that
wore the battery out very quickly that way, and I didn't know until it
actually failed to support the load.

The power goes out, and within milliseconds the SPS (it's not
a UPS) has taken over.

Technically speaking you're right, but I'm going by what is on the box to
keep it simple (at the cost of some correctness of course).

* APC also stands for aspirin-phenacetin-caffeine.

It's all in the context. I don't think you could expect much if you plugged
a box of Anacin into a wall outlet.



William

 

On Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:17:08 -0400, mm
<NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>wrote:

I just got a used APC Back-UPS 300 and somewhere it says that it is
for computer equipment only and not for medical equipment.

I had hoped to use this for my heart-lung machine, but since I can't
do that, can I back up a Philips DVDR and a couple clock radios with
it, even though those are not computer equipment?

I have my home kidney dialysis, hyperbaric chamber, and MRI scanner
hooked up to APC battery backup units with no problem. Should be no
problem with a heart-lung bypass machine which is a good thing to have
if you want to perform open heart surgery on yourself at home.

 

[William Sommerwerck]

I have my home kidney dialysis, hyperbaric chamber, and
MRI scanner hooked up to APC battery backup units with
no problem. Should be no problem with a heart-lung bypass
machine which is a good thing to have if you want to perform
open heart surgery on yourself at home.

Suture self.

 

[Bennett Price]

I've used a cheap Triplett UPS for years to keep power going to the
clocks on a VCR and TV w/o a problem. (Will only power TV when it's on
for a few minutes; when off, more than an hour.) Also good for the
nuclear reactor in my basement.

On 3/15/2010 2:17 PM, mm wrote:

I just got a used APC Back-UPS 300 and somewhere it says that it is
for computer equipment only and not for medical equipment.

I had hoped to use this for my heart-lung machine, but since I can't
do that, can I back up a Philips DVDR and a couple clock radios with
it, even though those are not computer equipment?


(Another weakness of the Philips 3576H DVDR is that it forgets all the
planned recording times if it's without power for more than a minute
or two.)

 

[Sylvia Else]

On 16/03/2010 8:17 AM, mm wrote:

not for medical equipment.

This is not of a concern for you, or the equipment. They just don't want
to be sued by your estate if the UPS should happen to be interrupted.

Sylvia.

 

[Bob F]

William Sommerwerck wrote:

I have my home kidney dialysis, hyperbaric chamber, and
MRI scanner hooked up to APC battery backup units with
no problem. Should be no problem with a heart-lung bypass
machine which is a good thing to have if you want to perform
open heart surgery on yourself at home.

Suture self.

LOL!

 

[Mike Tomlinson]

In article <hno882$i55$1@news.eternal-september.org>, William
Sommerwerck <grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> writes

Suture self.

oh, *ouch*

--
(\__/)
(='.'=) Bunny says Windows 7 is Vi$ta reloaded.
(")_(") http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/windows_7.png