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**Agreed. They're hopeless. But they are cheap. Mine are mains wiredNo wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off
so often even in the absence of smoke.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
Sylvia.
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off so
often even in the absence of smoke.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
I've just today replaced an optical one that I previously bought forOn 6/19/2012 12:49 PM, Sylvia Else wrote:
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off
so often even in the absence of smoke.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
Sylvia.
**Agreed. They're hopeless. But they are cheap. Mine are mains wired
units. Originally, they were ionisation types, but prone to false
alarms. I replaced them with photo-electric types. Two have failed in
six years. Failure means that I couldn't shut the damned things off.
Since they were mains powered and failure occured in the middle of the
night, I have to get the ladder out and disconnect the mains wiring. A
real PITA. The units were moderately expensive ones. They cost me $80.00
trade price. Not impressed. The $15.00, non mains powered one in the
workshop has never given me a moment's trouble.
99% never give a false alarm? I must be extraordinarily unlucky then."Sylvia Else is So Full of Shit"
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off so
often even in the absence of smoke.
** Sure, but they also detect water droplets and dust in the air as well as
smoke.
They may need occasional vacuum cleaning too.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
** 99% already do - you bullshitting nut case.
Forget that - it has one of these hidden on the reverse side of the board.The electronics seems rather basic.
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off
so often even in the absence of smoke.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
Perhaps I am extraordinarily lucky. My two battery powered cheaposOn 19/06/2012 1:20 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go
off so
often even in the absence of smoke.
** Sure, but they also detect water droplets and dust in the air as
well as
smoke.
They may need occasional vacuum cleaning too.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
** 99% already do
99% never give a false alarm? I must be extraordinarily unlucky then.
Sylvia.
If it were just nuisance trips from real smoke, then I wouldn't mind.On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 12:49:23 +1000, Sylvia Else
sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote as underneath my scribble :
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off
so often even in the absence of smoke.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
Never had any trouble with the cheap ones, except bipping when the
battery needs replacing, a trick is to not screw them onto anything,
leave on a high shelf etc in free air, then if you burn the toast etc,
just remove unit to a lower area for a few minutes to stop the
shouting..
Hmm....On 19/06/2012 1:49 PM, Sylvia Else wrote:
The electronics seems rather basic.
Forget that - it has one of these hidden on the reverse side of the board.
http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/170363/FREESCALE/MCZ145010EG.html
Sylvia.
Well I guess you are right Sylvia, you are just unlucky.On 19/06/2012 3:49 PM, Charlie+ wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jun 2012 12:49:23 +1000, Sylvia Else
sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote as underneath my scribble :
No wonder we keep hearing of cases where people die in fires where the
batteries have been removed from smoke alarms. The damned things go off
so often even in the absence of smoke.
How hard can it be to make one of these that works reliably?
Never had any trouble with the cheap ones, except bipping when the
battery needs replacing, a trick is to not screw them onto anything,
leave on a high shelf etc in free air, then if you burn the toast etc,
just remove unit to a lower area for a few minutes to stop the
shouting..
If it were just nuisance trips from real smoke, then I wouldn't mind.
But I've had these things go off in the early hours of the morning, more
than once, with no smoke, no one using a shower, nothing being cooked in
the kitchen, and no one stirring up dust.
It doesn't exactly make for a restful night's sleep.
Sylvia.
Condensation as the temperature drops maybe?If it were just nuisance trips from real smoke, then I wouldn't mind.
But I've had these things go off in the early hours of the morning, more
than once, with no smoke, no one using a shower, nothing being cooked in
the kitchen, and no one stirring up dust.
I have a smoke detector that is currently behaving in exactly theTemperature drop does seem to be the reason why the darn things choose
to start chirping at 3am to warn that the battery needs to be replaced
(battery voltage drops as the temp goes down).
When I had a battery-only detector that started to chirp in the middleOn Tue, 19 Jun 2012 19:42:47 GMT, woodag@trap.ozemail.com.au (Andy
Wood) put finger to keyboard and composed:
Temperature drop does seem to be the reason why the darn things choose
to start chirping at 3am to warn that the battery needs to be replaced
(battery voltage drops as the temp goes down).
I have a smoke detector that is currently behaving in exactly the
opposite way. During the day it is OK, but at night when the air
conditioner (heater) is switched on, the unit emits a low-battery
chirp.
Perhaps, though I'd be surprised if the inside of the house reaches theSylvia Else<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:
If it were just nuisance trips from real smoke, then I wouldn't mind.
But I've had these things go off in the early hours of the morning, more
than once, with no smoke, no one using a shower, nothing being cooked in
the kitchen, and no one stirring up dust.
Condensation as the temperature drops maybe?
I don't think the law has anything to say about replacing batteries inOf course, mains powered detectors are supposed to be installed by a
duly licensed person. That is fair enough, but when I was
investigating the detectors, I was amazed to find that for most of
them, the manufacturers tell you that replacing the backup battery
must also only be done by a licensed sparky! The ones I got were the
only ones I saw where that was not the case, perhaps due to the way
the mains gets unplugged as you open them.
Of course, mains powered detectors are supposed to be installed by a
duly licensed person. That is fair enough, but when I was
investigating the detectors, I was amazed to find that for most of
them, the manufacturers tell you that replacing the backup battery
must also only be done by a licensed sparky!
I don't think the law has anything to say about replacing batteries in
such detectors. More likely the manufacturer just doesn't want to get sued
if someone electrocutes themselves.
in QLD it does, in the rental tenancies act.
Whether it's safe is one thing. Whether it's permissible is another. In"Stupider than Anyone Else"
Of course, mains powered detectors are supposed to be installed by a
duly licensed person. That is fair enough, but when I was
investigating the detectors, I was amazed to find that for most of
them, the manufacturers tell you that replacing the backup battery
must also only be done by a licensed sparky!
I don't think the law has anything to say about replacing batteries in
such detectors. More likely the manufacturer just doesn't want to get sued
if someone electrocutes themselves.
** Mains powered detector/alarms are installed with permanent connection to
the AC supply and all the internal circuitry is live at 240 volts, so it is
not safe or permissible for un-unlicensed person to work on them.
Whether it's safe is one thing. Whether it's permissible is another. In
NSW, for example, it would depend on whether replacing the battery falls
within the definition of electrical wiring work in the Electricity
(Consumer Safety) Act 2004. I contend that it does not, at least in the
non-soldering case.
in QLD it does, in the rental tenancies act.On 20/06/2012 5:42 AM, Andy Wood wrote:
Sylvia Else<sylvia@not.here.invalid> wrote:
If it were just nuisance trips from real smoke, then I wouldn't mind.
But I've had these things go off in the early hours of the morning, more
than once, with no smoke, no one using a shower, nothing being cooked in
the kitchen, and no one stirring up dust.
Condensation as the temperature drops maybe?
Perhaps, though I'd be surprised if the inside of the house reaches the
dew point, and I've certainly never seen mist inside the house, nor
noticed condensation on any surface outside the bathroom, other than
window panes.
Of course, mains powered detectors are supposed to be installed by a
duly licensed person. That is fair enough, but when I was
investigating the detectors, I was amazed to find that for most of
them, the manufacturers tell you that replacing the backup battery
must also only be done by a licensed sparky! The ones I got were the
only ones I saw where that was not the case, perhaps due to the way
the mains gets unplugged as you open them.
I don't think the law has anything to say about replacing batteries in
such detectors. More likely the manufacturer just doesn't want to get
sued if someone electrocutes themselves.
Sylvia.