automobile directional signals

[Jon]

The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work. When you
turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back directional
light turn on but don't blink. They just turn on and stay on. The flashers
work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on how to fix it?

I thought it might be the capacitor but the 4-ways work ok and the left
signal works ok. Could it be a fuse? The switch? What would cause this
behavior?

Jon intrepid@bellaire.tv

 

[Ian Field]

"Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:efGdnSRxkJZG6E7SnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@earthlink.com...

The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work. When
you turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back
directional light turn on but don't blink. They just turn on and stay on.
The flashers work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on
how to fix it?

I thought it might be the capacitor but the 4-ways work ok and the left
signal works ok. Could it be a fuse? The switch? What would cause this
behavior?

Jon intrepid@bellaire.tv

Have you checked the RHS bulb wattages? Most indicators have a minimum
operating wattage so if one bulb blows the dash WL lights continually to
indicate a fault.

Earth point corrosion is another possibility - one of the indicator bulbs
could be grounding via other bulbs in the light cluster.

Look in the workshop manual for the correct bulb ratings - buy & fit them.
If still not flashing check lamp cluster earthing.

 

[Allodoxaphobia]

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, Jon wrote:

The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

As soon as the crackerjack mind-readers in sci.electronics.repair
devine the make and model of the car, they'll get right back to you.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, "Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote:

The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

No problem. Just tell her to make 3 left turns instead of a right
turn until you get it fixed.

When you
turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back directional
light turn on but don't blink.

Since you didn't bother to disclose the maker and model of her
vehicle, it would be difficult to determine if the flasher is a
bi-metallic thermal flasher, or an electronic flasher. If thermal,
such flashers cease flashing when a bulb is blown, has too small a
load, or is presented with a high resistance connection. They also
have the irritating habit of the contacts welding closed, which I
think (not sure) might produce those symptoms. Same arcing problem
with vehicles that have flasher relays.

They just turn on and stay on. The flashers
work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on how to fix it?

Sure. Clean contacts and connections (steering column switch, bulb
connectors, flasher connector, relay). Replace everything (bulbs,
relay, and flasher). Whatever you do last, is usually what fixes the
problem. My wild guess would be a flasher relay as in:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlVSNX_NaOs>

I thought it might be the capacitor

Probably not as it's the same capacitor on the left turn circuit.

but the 4-ways work ok and the left
signal works ok. Could it be a fuse? The switch? What would cause this
behavior?

Not the fuse but mighte be the switch. I'll bet on the relay.
Reminder: Make and model of vehicle.

Jon intrepid@bellaire.tv
--

Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[tm]

"Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:efGdnSRxkJZG6E7SnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@earthlink.com...

The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work. When
you turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back
directional light turn on but don't blink. They just turn on and stay on.
The flashers work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on
how to fix it?

I thought it might be the capacitor but the 4-ways work ok and the left
signal works ok. Could it be a fuse? The switch? What would cause this
behavior?

Jon intrepid@bellaire.tv

Is the ash tray full yet? You might be ready for a new car.

 

[Ian Field]

"spamtrap1888" <spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1f27b96b-5b4d-42e3-8c39-511faf9d9ac5@nl1g2000pbc.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 9, 10:09 am, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, "Jon" <jon8...@peoplepc.com> wrote:
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

No problem. Just tell her to make 3 left turns instead of a right
turn until you get it fixed.

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."

When you
turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back directional
light turn on but don't blink.

Since you didn't bother to disclose the maker and model of her
vehicle, it would be difficult to determine if the flasher is a
bi-metallic thermal flasher, or an electronic flasher. If thermal,
such flashers cease flashing when a bulb is blown, has too small a
load, or is presented with a high resistance connection. They also
have the irritating habit of the contacts welding closed, which I
think (not sure) might produce those symptoms. Same arcing problem
with vehicles that have flasher relays.

They just turn on and stay on. The flashers
work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on how to fix
it?

Sure. Clean contacts and connections (steering column switch, bulb
connectors, flasher connector, relay). Replace everything (bulbs,
relay, and flasher). Whatever you do last, is usually what fixes the
problem. My wild guess would be a flasher relay as in:

But the flasher relay works on the left turn signal.

I believe the flasher doesn't switch on the right because the load
draws more current than it should,
vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Pretty unlikely - it would flash fast and/or buzz if overloaded, in any
event the OP says the hazard flasher works OK, so the relay must be rated at
least 96W.

You have to meet the minimum wattage (somewhere around 42W) otherwise it
lights continuously to prompt investigation of possible blown bulb.

Either some numpty has put a 5W sidelight bulb instead of one of the
indicator bulbs, or there's an earthing failure on one of the light clusters
(the indicator is grounded via one of the sidelight bulbs).

Grounding faults at the rear often show up when the brake lights operate -
with sidelights off; the brake light grounds through the sidelight, so one
brake light is less than half bright .

With sidelights on; the affected sidelight grounds through the brake light
bulb - and goes out altogether when the brakes are applied.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 11:13:10 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
<spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote:

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."

Correct. Three ultra right wing politicians have the same effect as
one left wing politician.

Sure.  Clean contacts and connections (steering column switch, bulb
connectors, flasher connector, relay).  Replace everything (bulbs,
relay, and flasher).  Whatever you do last, is usually what fixes the
problem.  My wild guess would be a flasher relay as in:

But the flasher relay works on the left turn signal.

Yep and until we ascertain what manner of vehicle we're dealing with,
it's difficult to determine how it's wired and what might be wrong.
I'll pass instead of guess.

Turn signal wiring diagrams:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=turn+signal+wiring+diagram+relay&tbm=isch>
Note that most vehicles have TWO turn signal relays and sometimes TWO
thermal flashers:
<http://www.mg-tabc.org/techn-up/turn_signal_relay/turnsignalrelay.html>
<http://www.dezertrangers.com/vb/attachments/general-off-road-talk/136623d1202261254-turn-signal-relay-diagram.jpg>

I believe the flasher doesn't switch on the right because the load
draws more current than it should, indicating most likely that the
wrong bulb(s) were used or that somehow there is a current path
parallel to the bulb. First I would take out each bulb, checking to
see if the other flashes. (The open circuit should result in high
speed flashing, then reseat the bulbs and try again. Make a note of
the bulb numbers and check against owner's manual.

In my limited experience, an open circuit usually results in no lights
flashing because there is no circuit between the flasher and the
bulbs. However, if one of the two bulbs involved was blown, the
remaining light will light and not flash, while the blow light will
ummm... act like a blown light and not light. In this case, both
lights are lit, which makes a bulb failure unlikely.

IIRC, when we used to go trailering we had to put a heavier duty
signal-stat into our car, to switch the increased load of the parallel
trailer turn signal lights. Otherwise they would just light up.

That's a likely possibility. However, my crystal ball and Ouija Board
both concur that the most likely culprit is an arced shut relay.
Hopefully, when the OP returns, we can determine whether your logic
and experience will triumph over my guesswork and magic.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[spamtrap1888]

On Jun 9, 10:09 am, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, "Jon" <jon8...@peoplepc.com> wrote:
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

No problem.  Just tell her to make 3 left turns instead of a right
turn until you get it fixed.

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."

When you
turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back directional
light turn on but don't blink.

Since you didn't bother to disclose the maker and model of her
vehicle, it would be difficult to determine if the flasher is a
bi-metallic thermal flasher, or an electronic flasher.  If thermal,
such flashers cease flashing when a bulb is blown, has too small a
load, or is presented with a high resistance connection.  They also
have the irritating habit of the contacts welding closed, which I
think (not sure) might produce those symptoms.  Same arcing problem
with vehicles that have flasher relays.

They just turn on and stay on.  The flashers
work ok.  The left directional signal works ok.  Any ideas on how to fix it?

Sure.  Clean contacts and connections (steering column switch, bulb
connectors, flasher connector, relay).  Replace everything (bulbs,
relay, and flasher).  Whatever you do last, is usually what fixes the
problem.  My wild guess would be a flasher relay as in:

But the flasher relay works on the left turn signal.

I believe the flasher doesn't switch on the right because the load
draws more current than it should, indicating most likely that the
wrong bulb(s) were used or that somehow there is a current path
parallel to the bulb. First I would take out each bulb, checking to
see if the other flashes. (The open circuit should result in high
speed flashing, then reseat the bulbs and try again. Make a note of
the bulb numbers and check against owner's manual.

IIRC, when we used to go trailering we had to put a heavier duty
signal-stat into our car, to switch the increased load of the parallel
trailer turn signal lights. Otherwise they would just light up.

 

[Evan Platt]

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 19:33:42 +0100, "Ian Field"
<gangprobing.alien@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."

Two wrongs may not make a right, but two Wrights make an airplane.
--
To reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious and .invalid from my e-mail address.

 

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 09 Jun 2012 17:47:08 -0700, Evan Platt
<evan@theobvious.espphotography.com.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 19:33:42 +0100, "Ian Field"
gangprobing.alien@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."

Two wrongs may not make a right, but two Wrights make an airplane.

Here's the poster:
<http://www.motifake.com/silly-philosopher-wilbur-orville-wright-salute-you-demotivational-posters-125255.html>

Several successive wrongs cannot make a right, but statistically, the
next wild guess will be a right.

Two wrongs do not make a right, but do tend to create a pattern or
policy.

Two right angles make a parallel.

Repeat a wrong often enough, and it becomes a right.

Two wrongs making rights or wrongs is irrelevant to those that can't
recognized the difference between right and wrong.

One oh-shit can negate a lifetime of rights.

That which is most obviously correct, beyond any need of checking, is
probably a wrong.

When all the wrongs have been eliminated, whatever remains, no matter
how improbable, must be a right.

For every right, there are an infinite number of wrongs.
For every wrong, there is a very limited number of rights.
Therefore, most of reality is wrong.

Everything on the line below is right.
Everything on the line above is wrong.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

 

[Rheilly Phoull]

On 6/10/2012 2:33 AM, Ian Field wrote:

"spamtrap1888"<spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1f27b96b-5b4d-42e3-8c39-511faf9d9ac5@nl1g2000pbc.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 9, 10:09 am, Jeff Liebermann<je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, "Jon"<jon8...@peoplepc.com> wrote:
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

No problem. Just tell her to make 3 left turns instead of a right
turn until you get it fixed.

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."


When you
turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back directional
light turn on but don't blink.

Since you didn't bother to disclose the maker and model of her
vehicle, it would be difficult to determine if the flasher is a
bi-metallic thermal flasher, or an electronic flasher. If thermal,
such flashers cease flashing when a bulb is blown, has too small a
load, or is presented with a high resistance connection. They also
have the irritating habit of the contacts welding closed, which I
think (not sure) might produce those symptoms. Same arcing problem
with vehicles that have flasher relays.

They just turn on and stay on. The flashers
work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on how to fix
it?

Sure. Clean contacts and connections (steering column switch, bulb
connectors, flasher connector, relay). Replace everything (bulbs,
relay, and flasher). Whatever you do last, is usually what fixes the
problem. My wild guess would be a flasher relay as in:

But the flasher relay works on the left turn signal.

I believe the flasher doesn't switch on the right because the load
draws more current than it should,
vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Pretty unlikely - it would flash fast and/or buzz if overloaded, in any
event the OP says the hazard flasher works OK, so the relay must be rated at
least 96W.

You have to meet the minimum wattage (somewhere around 42W) otherwise it
lights continuously to prompt investigation of possible blown bulb.

Either some numpty has put a 5W sidelight bulb instead of one of the
indicator bulbs, or there's an earthing failure on one of the light clusters
(the indicator is grounded via one of the sidelight bulbs).

Grounding faults at the rear often show up when the brake lights operate -
with sidelights off; the brake light grounds through the sidelight, so one
brake light is less than half bright .

With sidelights on; the affected sidelight grounds through the brake light
bulb - and goes out altogether when the brakes are applied.

Well most likely fault is the earth connection to one of the lamps which
would also fit with a low current not operating the flasher.
Assuming of course the correct wattage lamps are fitted and it is not an
electronic flasher.

 

[Jon]

"Allodoxaphobia" <knock_yourself_out@example.net> wrote in message
news:slrnjt6v1h.25v5.knock_yourself_out@shell.config.com...

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, Jon wrote:
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

As soon as the crackerjack mind-readers in sci.electronics.repair
devine the make and model of the car, they'll get right back to you.

I just bought 2 bulbs for a 1994 Mercury Marquis for $1.36 each. I didn't
know if it was the back or the front, so I guessed and chose the rear. Then
there were two bulbs. I didn't know which one might be bad. I had two new
bulbs so I put both of them in and they started blinking. So I guess I
solved the problem. I put everything back together, tested it again and it
worked ok.

 

[Ian Field]

"Rheilly Phoull" <rheilly@bigslong.com> wrote in message
news:Z8udnZ4Tyaiaj0nSnZ2dnUVZ_tmdnZ2d@westnet.com.au...

On 6/10/2012 2:33 AM, Ian Field wrote:
"spamtrap1888"<spamtrap1888@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1f27b96b-5b4d-42e3-8c39-511faf9d9ac5@nl1g2000pbc.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 9, 10:09 am, Jeff Liebermann<je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, "Jon"<jon8...@peoplepc.com> wrote:
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

No problem. Just tell her to make 3 left turns instead of a right
turn until you get it fixed.

I have memorized this rule of thumb as "Two wrongs don't make a right,
but three rights make a left."


When you
turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back
directional
light turn on but don't blink.

Since you didn't bother to disclose the maker and model of her
vehicle, it would be difficult to determine if the flasher is a
bi-metallic thermal flasher, or an electronic flasher. If thermal,
such flashers cease flashing when a bulb is blown, has too small a
load, or is presented with a high resistance connection. They also
have the irritating habit of the contacts welding closed, which I
think (not sure) might produce those symptoms. Same arcing problem
with vehicles that have flasher relays.

They just turn on and stay on. The flashers
work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any ideas on how to fix
it?

Sure. Clean contacts and connections (steering column switch, bulb
connectors, flasher connector, relay). Replace everything (bulbs,
relay, and flasher). Whatever you do last, is usually what fixes the
problem. My wild guess would be a flasher relay as in:

But the flasher relay works on the left turn signal.

I believe the flasher doesn't switch on the right because the load
draws more current than it should,
vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Pretty unlikely - it would flash fast and/or buzz if overloaded, in any
event the OP says the hazard flasher works OK, so the relay must be rated
at
least 96W.

You have to meet the minimum wattage (somewhere around 42W) otherwise it
lights continuously to prompt investigation of possible blown bulb.

Either some numpty has put a 5W sidelight bulb instead of one of the
indicator bulbs, or there's an earthing failure on one of the light
clusters
(the indicator is grounded via one of the sidelight bulbs).

Grounding faults at the rear often show up when the brake lights
operate -
with sidelights off; the brake light grounds through the sidelight, so
one
brake light is less than half bright .

With sidelights on; the affected sidelight grounds through the brake
light
bulb - and goes out altogether when the brakes are applied.



Well most likely fault is the earth connection to one of the lamps which
would also fit with a low current not operating the flasher.
Assuming of course the correct wattage lamps are fitted and it is not an
electronic flasher.

The motorcycle electronic flasher I recently stripped looks like it wouldn't
stop blinking to indicate a fault if a bulb blew, like a proper car one
would.

I sort of prefer to replace bike indicator relays with car one's - they just
seem to work better. So any excuse will do.

The majority of car types I've pried open for a look inside; use a Siemens
chip with a pin for a current sensing resistor.

Its designed to meet all sorts of rules & regulations - which the bike one I
stripped obviously didn't.

The schematic is posted on A.B.S.E with subject line: Indicator relay
post-mortem.

 

[spamtrap1888]

On Jun 9, 8:32 pm, "Jon" <jon8...@peoplepc.com> wrote:

"Allodoxaphobia" <knock_yourself_...@example.net> wrote in message

news:slrnjt6v1h.25v5.knock_yourself_out@shell.config.com...

On Sat, 9 Jun 2012 12:12:12 -0400, Jon wrote:
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work.

As soon as the crackerjack mind-readers in sci.electronics.repair
devine the make and model of the car, they'll get right back to you.

I just bought 2 bulbs for a 1994 Mercury Marquis for $1.36 each.  I didn't
know if it was the back or the front, so I guessed and chose the rear.  Then
there were two bulbs.  I didn't know which one might be bad.  I had two new
bulbs so I put both of them in and they started blinking.  So I guess I
solved the problem.  I put everything back together, tested it again and it
worked ok.

Aha!

Knowing what the old bulbs were would be instructive, assuming that
they had been lighting up, because we could compare their rated
current draw to that of the proper bulbs. (Assuming the car is indeed
a Mercury Marquis.)

 

[Jon]

"tm" <No_one_home@white-house.gov> wrote in message
news:jr01gn$ae2$1@dont-email.me...

"Jon" <jon8338@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:efGdnSRxkJZG6E7SnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@earthlink.com...
The right directional signal on my girlfriend's car doesn't work. When
you turn on the right directional signal, both the front and back
directional light turn on but don't blink. They just turn on and stay
on. The flashers work ok. The left directional signal works ok. Any
ideas on how to fix it?

I thought it might be the capacitor but the 4-ways work ok and the left
signal works ok. Could it be a fuse? The switch? What would cause this
behavior?

Jon intrepid@bellaire.tv

Is the ash tray full yet? You might be ready for a new car.

very funny. I fixed the lights a few weeks ago. was it the front or the
rear? I just chose the rear, and I replaced both bulbs. Now it works so
forget it. It doesn't matter why. Jon

 

[Winston]

Jon wrote:

(...)

very funny. I fixed the lights a few weeks ago. was it the front or the
rear? I just chose the rear, and I replaced both bulbs. Now it works so
forget it. It doesn't matter why. Jon

"Directional Signals"?

I've been driving in California for the last few decades
and have completely forgotten what part of the car that is.

Can you help?



--Winston