Another old Pioneer SX-434 question-speakers

Thanks to all those who replied to my last questions about my old
SX-434. I have done everything advised except actually powering it up.
I have decided to power it up slowly by using my nice isolated output
Staco variable transformer. I do not as yet have speakers for the
thing and will be looking for some used ones. Besides being 8 ohms
what should I look for? I have always bought speakers and amps at the
same time, listening to them before buying. But since the SX-434 is
going into my shop, and may not work when power is finally applied,
I'm not too keen on buying new speakers. At least not yet. This amp
has a 15 watt output. Besides listening what else should I look for
when buying speakers? My plan is to power the thing up with speakers
from another stereo just to see if it works. Then I'll be off to the
local thrift stores to see what they have to offer. And I'll bring the
SX-434 along to test the speakers. But it has been so long since I
bought speakers I don't remember what to look for. Is there any easy
way to test the efficiency of the speakers? Any brands to look for?
These speakers will be hanging from a plywood wall about 12 feet up in
my machine shop. I really don't care about the size because they will
be totally out of the way.
Thanks,
Eric

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[Bob Masta]

On Wed, 05 Mar 2014 17:38:55 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

Thanks to all those who replied to my last questions about my old
SX-434. I have done everything advised except actually powering it up.
I have decided to power it up slowly by using my nice isolated output
Staco variable transformer. I do not as yet have speakers for the
thing and will be looking for some used ones. Besides being 8 ohms
what should I look for? I have always bought speakers and amps at the
same time, listening to them before buying. But since the SX-434 is
going into my shop, and may not work when power is finally applied,
I'm not too keen on buying new speakers. At least not yet. This amp
has a 15 watt output. Besides listening what else should I look for
when buying speakers? My plan is to power the thing up with speakers
from another stereo just to see if it works. Then I'll be off to the
local thrift stores to see what they have to offer. And I'll bring the
SX-434 along to test the speakers. But it has been so long since I
bought speakers I don't remember what to look for. Is there any easy
way to test the efficiency of the speakers? Any brands to look for?
These speakers will be hanging from a plywood wall about 12 feet up in
my machine shop. I really don't care about the size because they will
be totally out of the way.
Thanks,
Eric

The two most obvious points are that the speakers be rated
to handle 15 watts, and that they be either 4 or 8 ohms.
(The SX-434 can handle either.)

15 watts is a fairly modest speaker rating, but it's above
the usual "computer speakers". Any ordinary "bookshelf
speaker" will be probably fine. All are either 4 or 8 ohms.

To test efficiency (in the sense you mean), you'd need some
sort of calibrated source material, plus a way to measure
the output level. For your purposes, just listening should
be OK for the latter. For a "calibrated" source, bring a
portable CD player and use a piece of tape on its volume
control so it doesn't get changed. On the SX-434, note the
volume position and keep it the same for all tests.

However, I think that efficiency is probably not what you
should be shooting for. Instead, go for decent frequency
response. You can tell that by listening to your CD, and
picking the speakers that sound best to your ears. As a
general rule of thumb, smaller speakers will have reduced
bass response. But bigger isn't automatically better: A
poorly-designed big box can sound boomy, for example.
That's why you have to listen for yourself.

You can enhance the bass in your shop by hanging the
speakers near the corners. A 3-way room corner gives the
biggest effect, followed by a 2-way (wall-ceiling or
wall-wall).

Best regards,


Bob Masta

DAQARTA v7.50
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com
Scope, Spectrum, Spectrogram, Sound Level Meter
Frequency Counter, Pitch Track, Pitch-to-MIDI
FREE Signal Generator, DaqMusiq generator
Science with your sound card!

 

On Thu, 06 Mar 2014 13:35:27 GMT, N0Spam@daqarta.com (Bob Masta)
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Mar 2014 17:38:55 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

Thanks to all those who replied to my last questions about my old
SX-434. I have done everything advised except actually powering it up.
I have decided to power it up slowly by using my nice isolated output
Staco variable transformer. I do not as yet have speakers for the
thing and will be looking for some used ones. Besides being 8 ohms
what should I look for? I have always bought speakers and amps at the
same time, listening to them before buying. But since the SX-434 is
going into my shop, and may not work when power is finally applied,
I'm not too keen on buying new speakers. At least not yet. This amp
has a 15 watt output. Besides listening what else should I look for
when buying speakers? My plan is to power the thing up with speakers
from another stereo just to see if it works. Then I'll be off to the
local thrift stores to see what they have to offer. And I'll bring the
SX-434 along to test the speakers. But it has been so long since I
bought speakers I don't remember what to look for. Is there any easy
way to test the efficiency of the speakers? Any brands to look for?
These speakers will be hanging from a plywood wall about 12 feet up in
my machine shop. I really don't care about the size because they will
be totally out of the way.
Thanks,
Eric

The two most obvious points are that the speakers be rated
to handle 15 watts, and that they be either 4 or 8 ohms.
(The SX-434 can handle either.)

15 watts is a fairly modest speaker rating, but it's above
the usual "computer speakers". Any ordinary "bookshelf
speaker" will be probably fine. All are either 4 or 8 ohms.

To test efficiency (in the sense you mean), you'd need some
sort of calibrated source material, plus a way to measure
the output level. For your purposes, just listening should
be OK for the latter. For a "calibrated" source, bring a
portable CD player and use a piece of tape on its volume
control so it doesn't get changed. On the SX-434, note the
volume position and keep it the same for all tests.

However, I think that efficiency is probably not what you
should be shooting for. Instead, go for decent frequency
response. You can tell that by listening to your CD, and
picking the speakers that sound best to your ears. As a
general rule of thumb, smaller speakers will have reduced
bass response. But bigger isn't automatically better: A
poorly-designed big box can sound boomy, for example.
That's why you have to listen for yourself.

You can enhance the bass in your shop by hanging the
speakers near the corners. A 3-way room corner gives the
biggest effect, followed by a 2-way (wall-ceiling or
wall-wall).

Best regards,


Bob Masta

DAQARTA v7.50
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com
Scope, Spectrum, Spectrogram, Sound Level Meter
Frequency Counter, Pitch Track, Pitch-to-MIDI
FREE Signal Generator, DaqMusiq generator
Science with your sound card!

Thanks for the reply Bob. As it turns out I can get close to then
three way corner you suggest. So I'll mount the speakers there first
and see how they sound. I guess I'll test the SX-434 first on low
volume with some computer speakers and if it works then I'll lug it
and an MP3 player to the thrift store and try some speakers.
Eric

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[Bob Masta]

On Thu, 06 Mar 2014 09:44:31 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

On Thu, 06 Mar 2014 13:35:27 GMT, N0Spam@daqarta.com (Bob Masta)
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Mar 2014 17:38:55 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:

Thanks to all those who replied to my last questions about my old
SX-434. I have done everything advised except actually powering it up.
I have decided to power it up slowly by using my nice isolated output
Staco variable transformer. I do not as yet have speakers for the
thing and will be looking for some used ones. Besides being 8 ohms
what should I look for? I have always bought speakers and amps at the
same time, listening to them before buying. But since the SX-434 is
going into my shop, and may not work when power is finally applied,
I'm not too keen on buying new speakers. At least not yet. This amp
has a 15 watt output. Besides listening what else should I look for
when buying speakers? My plan is to power the thing up with speakers
from another stereo just to see if it works. Then I'll be off to the
local thrift stores to see what they have to offer. And I'll bring the
SX-434 along to test the speakers. But it has been so long since I
bought speakers I don't remember what to look for. Is there any easy
way to test the efficiency of the speakers? Any brands to look for?
These speakers will be hanging from a plywood wall about 12 feet up in
my machine shop. I really don't care about the size because they will
be totally out of the way.
Thanks,
Eric

The two most obvious points are that the speakers be rated
to handle 15 watts, and that they be either 4 or 8 ohms.
(The SX-434 can handle either.)

15 watts is a fairly modest speaker rating, but it's above
the usual "computer speakers". Any ordinary "bookshelf
speaker" will be probably fine. All are either 4 or 8 ohms.

To test efficiency (in the sense you mean), you'd need some
sort of calibrated source material, plus a way to measure
the output level. For your purposes, just listening should
be OK for the latter. For a "calibrated" source, bring a
portable CD player and use a piece of tape on its volume
control so it doesn't get changed. On the SX-434, note the
volume position and keep it the same for all tests.

However, I think that efficiency is probably not what you
should be shooting for. Instead, go for decent frequency
response. You can tell that by listening to your CD, and
picking the speakers that sound best to your ears. As a
general rule of thumb, smaller speakers will have reduced
bass response. But bigger isn't automatically better: A
poorly-designed big box can sound boomy, for example.
That's why you have to listen for yourself.

You can enhance the bass in your shop by hanging the
speakers near the corners. A 3-way room corner gives the
biggest effect, followed by a 2-way (wall-ceiling or
wall-wall).

Best regards,


Bob Masta

DAQARTA v7.50
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com
Scope, Spectrum, Spectrogram, Sound Level Meter
Frequency Counter, Pitch Track, Pitch-to-MIDI
FREE Signal Generator, DaqMusiq generator
Science with your sound card!
Thanks for the reply Bob. As it turns out I can get close to then
three way corner you suggest. So I'll mount the speakers there first
and see how they sound. I guess I'll test the SX-434 first on low
volume with some computer speakers and if it works then I'll lug it
and an MP3 player to the thrift store and try some speakers.
Eric

I forgot to mention one important detail when looking for
used speakers: Back around 1980 or so they started using
foam surrounds on the woofers. (The surround is that
flexible ring between the moving cone and the rigid frame.)
Used to be just accordion pleats in the paper cone, or
treated fabric, or butyl rubber, etc. But the foam was very
light and flexible (and probably very cheap as well), so it
must have seemed perfect for this job. The only problem is
that the foam breaks down over time, until it totally
disintegrates. (You may have seen this on old foam ear
cushions on headphones, for example.)

Dunno when they stopped using this stuff, or even if some
speakers are still being made with it, but it is Bad News.

So, if you can remove the grille without damaging anything,
take a look at the surround. Wipe your finger lightly
around it and see if it is falling apart. Many grilles are
just held in by Velcro or snaps, or press-fit into a molding
around the front face of the enclosure.

Other than visual inspection, you'll probably know if the
surround is totally deteriorated since the speaker will make
horrible knocking and grating sounds on low bass notes.
It's the just-shy-of-dying speakers that you need to watch
out for. Hopefully, those foam surround speakers are long
gone by now, but it doesn't hurt to check.

(Places like Parts Express sell kits to replace the
surround, but it involves nerve-wracking major surgery...
not worth it in most cases.)

Best regards,


Bob Masta

DAQARTA v7.50
Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis
www.daqarta.com
Scope, Spectrum, Spectrogram, Sound Level Meter
Frequency Counter, Pitch Track, Pitch-to-MIDI
FREE Signal Generator, DaqMusiq generator
Science with your sound card!