A bright idea.

P

Peter

Guest
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better for the
environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light bulbs with new
ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being replaced orverseas with
even newer ones that are more environmental and economical at a cost of
$20'ish each.

--
:p
 
On 06-Jul-11 5:32 PM, Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better for the
environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light bulbs with new
ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being replaced orverseas with
even newer ones that are more environmental and economical at a cost of
$20'ish each.
Click to expand...
Can't wait for the $250 ones, we will save a fortune :)

Cheers Don...

============


--
Don McKenzie

Dontronics Blog: http://www.GodzillaSeaMonkey.com
Dontronics Site Map: http://www.dontronics.com/sitemap
E-Mail Contact Page: http://www.dontronics.com/email
Web Camera Page: http://www.dontronics.com/webcam
No More Damn Spam: http://www.dontronics.com/spam

New MMBasic Computer http://www.TheMaximiteComputer.com

These products will reduce in price by 5% every month:
http://www.dontronics-shop.com/minus-5-every-month.html
http://www.dontronics-shop.com/ics.html

Bare Proto PCB for PIC or AVR projects?
"I'd buy that for a Dollar!".
http://www.dontronics-shop.com/simmstick-fifteen-years-on.html
 
On 6/07/2011 5:55 PM, Don McKenzie wrote:
On 06-Jul-11 5:32 PM, Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the
environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light bulbs with new
ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being replaced orverseas
with
even newer ones that are more environmental and economical at a cost of
$20'ish each.

Can't wait for the $250 ones, we will save a fortune :)

Cheers Don...

============


Already using low voltage led's with a common dc rail around the house
Click to expand...

--
X-No-Archive: Yes
 
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.
Click to expand...
**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your abject
nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6 years, I've
experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward possum and the other
was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a rock and punctured the tube.
The CFLs are used from between a few minutes per day and several hours per
day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used VERY
infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption. I've had 7
failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around $3.00.

I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than 1 hour per
month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement cost was (last I
purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the light fitting is unsuitable
for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
On 7/07/2011 8:58 AM, Trevor Wilson wrote:
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your abject
nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6 years, I've
experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward possum and the other
was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a rock and punctured the tube.
The CFLs are used from between a few minutes per day and several hours per
day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used VERY
infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption. I've had 7
failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around $3.00.

I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than 1 hour per
month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement cost was (last I
purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the light fitting is unsuitable
for any other type of lamp.


You have been lucky with your CFLs. Over the 4 years that I have lived
Click to expand...
in this house, I have replaced twice as many of them, than Halogens.
 
"keithr" <keith@nowhere.com.au> wrote in message
news:4e1519d7@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
On 7/07/2011 8:58 AM, Trevor Wilson wrote:
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your abject
nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6 years,
I've
experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward possum and the
other
was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a rock and punctured the
tube.
The CFLs are used from between a few minutes per day and several hours
per
day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used VERY
infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption. I've had 7
failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around $3.00.

I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than 1 hour
per
month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement cost was (last I
purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the light fitting is
unsuitable
for any other type of lamp.


You have been lucky with your CFLs. Over the 4 years that I have lived in
this house, I have replaced twice as many of them, than Halogens.
Click to expand...

My 1st mistake was buying Nelson brand lamps, most crapped out within 12
months, a couple even smoked up.

My 2nd mistake was buying enough "warm white" Philips brand bulbs to find
that warm white was more like "dull yellow".
 
keithr wrote:
On 7/07/2011 8:58 AM, Trevor Wilson wrote:
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6
years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward
possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a
rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used from between a few
minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used
VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption.
I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around
$3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than
1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


You have been lucky with your CFLs. Over the 4 years that I have lived
in this house, I have replaced twice as many of them, than Halogens.
Click to expand...
**Zero CFL failures (excepting those that failed from mechanical means) is
not "luck". 7 failures of halogens (using SMPS transformers) is not 'bad
luck'. 3 failures of 100 Watt incandescent is not 'bad luck'.

My mains Voltage hovers at around 245 - 247 VAC most of the time.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
On Jul 7, 1:03 pm, "Dennis" <den...@blibber.com> wrote:
"keithr" <ke...@nowhere.com.au> wrote in message

news:4e1519d7@dnews.tpgi.com.au...



On 7/07/2011 8:58 AM, Trevor Wilson wrote:
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your abject
nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6 years,
I've
experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward possum and the
other
was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a rock and punctured the
tube.
The CFLs are used from between a few minutes per day and several hours
per
day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used VERY
infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption. I've had 7
failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around $3.00.

I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than 1 hour
per
month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement cost was (last I
purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the light fitting is
unsuitable
for any other type of lamp.

You have been lucky with your CFLs. Over the 4 years that I have lived in
this house, I have replaced twice as many of them, than Halogens.

My 1st mistake was buying Nelson brand lamps, most crapped out within 12
months, a couple even smoked up.

My 2nd mistake was buying enough "warm white" Philips brand bulbs to find
that warm white was more like "dull yellow".
Click to expand...

Warm White is a putrid colour for a lamp, but its getting hard to find
cool white ones (which look a lot better)
 
Trevor Wilson wrote:

**Zero CFL failures (excepting those that failed from mechanical means) is
not "luck". 7 failures of halogens (using SMPS transformers) is not 'bad
luck'. 3 failures of 100 Watt incandescent is not 'bad luck'.

My mains Voltage hovers at around 245 - 247 VAC most of the time.
Click to expand...
Those voltages are typical of what you'll find at our place too.

However, I've noted a high infant mortality rate with CFLs, *IF* they
live past 6 months or so, they're likely to live for the long stretch
(two years and counting on the ones I'm keeping track of).

I've had a typical incandescent last about 6-9 months or so.

Dollar for dollar, those CFL's (the one's that DO last) will need to
last a bloody long time to make up for their increased cost compared to
incandescents.
--
Predicting the future of technology is fraud with peril!
 
On Jul 7, 3:58 pm, John Tserkezis
<j...@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote:
Trevor Wilson wrote:
**Zero CFL failures (excepting those that failed from mechanical means) is
not "luck". 7 failures of halogens (using SMPS transformers) is not 'bad
luck'. 3 failures of 100 Watt incandescent is not 'bad luck'.
My mains Voltage hovers at around 245 - 247 VAC most of the time.

Those voltages are typical of what you'll find at our place too.

 However, I've noted a high infant mortality rate with CFLs, *IF* they
live past 6 months or so, they're likely to live for the long stretch
(two years and counting on the ones I'm keeping track of).

 I've had a typical incandescent last about 6-9 months or so.

 Dollar for dollar, those CFL's (the one's that DO last) will need to
last a bloody long time to make up for their increased cost compared to
incandescents.
--
Predicting the future of technology is fraud with peril!
Click to expand...

Problem is that you can't buy typical domestic incandescents now.
Well you can from RS components as "rough service lamps" but they are
as expensive as
CFL's
 
John Tserkezis wrote:
Trevor Wilson wrote:

**Zero CFL failures (excepting those that failed from mechanical
means) is not "luck". 7 failures of halogens (using SMPS
transformers) is not 'bad luck'. 3 failures of 100 Watt incandescent
is not 'bad luck'.

My mains Voltage hovers at around 245 - 247 VAC most of the time.

Those voltages are typical of what you'll find at our place too.

However, I've noted a high infant mortality rate with CFLs, *IF* they
live past 6 months or so, they're likely to live for the long stretch
(two years and counting on the ones I'm keeping track of).

I've had a typical incandescent last about 6-9 months or so.

Dollar for dollar, those CFL's (the one's that DO last) will need to
last a bloody long time to make up for their increased cost compared
to incandescents.
Click to expand...
**Six years and counting, for me. I'm happy with that.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your abject
nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6 years, I've
experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward possum and the other
was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a rock and punctured the
tube. The CFLs are used from between a few minutes per day and several
hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used VERY
infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption. I've had 7
failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around $3.00.

I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than 1 hour
per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement cost was
(last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the light fitting is
unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........
Click to expand...
 
John Tserkezis <jt@techniciansyndrome.org.invalid> wrote:

Trevor Wilson wrote:

**Zero CFL failures (excepting those that failed from mechanical means) is
not "luck". 7 failures of halogens (using SMPS transformers) is not 'bad
luck'. 3 failures of 100 Watt incandescent is not 'bad luck'.

My mains Voltage hovers at around 245 - 247 VAC most of the time.

Those voltages are typical of what you'll find at our place too.

However, I've noted a high infant mortality rate with CFLs, *IF* they
live past 6 months or so, they're likely to live for the long stretch
(two years and counting on the ones I'm keeping track of).

I've had a typical incandescent last about 6-9 months or so.

Dollar for dollar, those CFL's (the one's that DO last) will need to
last a bloody long time to make up for their increased cost compared to
incandescents.
Click to expand...
Many years ago I started writing the date on the base of lamps when I
installed them so that I would have something more than a gut feeling
of how long the things were lasting.

Now, as I replace lamps, I record the information in a simple
spreadsheet with info like brand, type of lamp, where used, date
installed, date replaced, cost, and claimed lifetime. The claimed life
for a CFL can be anywhere between 6,000 and 15,000 hours - it is
usually but not always on the packaging. In the same spreadsheet I
have results for small fluorescents called PL or PL-S lamps that are
not your traditional CFL with electronics crammed into the base of the
lamp (the ballast is in the light fitting, not in the lamp).

To determine if a lamp has lasted for anything like the claimed
lifetime I need to know what percentage of the time they were on,
which often means taking an educated guess, but for some lamps that
were automatically switched on, I have a much better idea. Flawed and
unscientific as this process no doubt is I continue to do it as I find
the results interesting.

Excluding the PL lamps with no electronics to fail, the worst of the
CFLs was a $1.25 cheapie that died at 20% of claimed life, while the
best was as Osram "Duluxstar minitwist" that made it to 133%. I have
another of the same Osram lamps, still in use, that is at 122% today,
but two more died at 26% and 57% respectively, beaten by another of
the $1.25 specials that made it to 68%.

On average, they are lasting to around 60% of claimed life, but I
don't have all that many results to go on.


Andy Wood
woodag@trap.ozemail.com.au
 
Metro wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6
years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward
possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a
rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used from between a few
minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used
VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption.
I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around
$3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than
1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........
Click to expand...
**Just waiting for a suitable LED replacement.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
Another factor affecting CFL lifetime is the type of light fitting and
their orientation. If there is little air circulation or heat
conduction the base will get very hot and eventually a component will
fair.
 
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97nae3Fi1cU3@mid.individual.net...
Metro wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6
years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward
possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a
rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used from between a few
minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used
VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption.
I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around
$3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than
1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........

**Just waiting for a suitable LED replacement.
Click to expand...
LEDs ain't the ants pants either...
I recently bought a 5W 12VAC LED light in MR16 26deg. spotlight form
that was on special - I got for about AUD10. I thought it would run
much cooler than the halogen it replaces - well it does, but it still gets
hot enough to boil water.
It is somewhere between a 10W and 20W halogen in brightness, but while
an enclosed halogen bulb is happy to run hot without any heatsinking, the
LED needs a complex cast aluminium heatsink that gets very hot.
Turns out that these high power lighting LEDs dissipate around 85% of the
power in heat - so only low-power LEDs run cool. The hotter the LED gets
the shorter its life and the light output also goes down - so your 10,000
hour 450 cd LED may not get anywhere near that if it is running hot.

The bottom line is that light fittings designed for halogens may not be
suitable for LEDs due to inadequate ventilation. Beware !
The solution is to use fittings actually designed for LEDs and not to
retrofit LEDs into old halogen fittings.

Yaputya
 
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
Metro wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is better
for the environment and our pocket to replace (even working) light
bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although these ones are being
replaced orverseas with even newer ones that are more environmental
and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a high
quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6
years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward
possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto a
rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used from between a few
minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are used
VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power consumption.
I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each downlight is around
$3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten incandescent. It is used less than
1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........

**Just waiting for a suitable LED replacement.
Click to expand...
**idiot.
They are the ones being sold overseas for $20'ish dollars.

--
:p
 
yaputya wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97nae3Fi1cU3@mid.individual.net...
Metro wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is
better for the environment and our pocket to replace (even
working) light bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although
these ones are being replaced orverseas with even newer ones that
are more environmental and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a
high quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6
years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward
possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto
a rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used from between a few
minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are
used VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power
consumption. I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each
downlight is around $3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten
incandescent. It is used less than 1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........

**Just waiting for a suitable LED replacement.

LEDs ain't the ants pants either...
I recently bought a 5W 12VAC LED light in MR16 26deg. spotlight form
that was on special - I got for about AUD10. I thought it would run
much cooler than the halogen it replaces - well it does, but it still
gets hot enough to boil water.
It is somewhere between a 10W and 20W halogen in brightness, but while
an enclosed halogen bulb is happy to run hot without any heatsinking,
the LED needs a complex cast aluminium heatsink that gets very hot.
Turns out that these high power lighting LEDs dissipate around 85% of
the power in heat - so only low-power LEDs run cool. The hotter the
LED gets the shorter its life and the light output also goes down -
so your 10,000 hour 450 cd LED may not get anywhere near that if it
is running hot.
The bottom line is that light fittings designed for halogens may not
be suitable for LEDs due to inadequate ventilation. Beware !
The solution is to use fittings actually designed for LEDs and not to
retrofit LEDs into old halogen fittings.
Click to expand...
**I am well aware of the issues and limitations associated with LEDs. I am
also aware that around 15 Watts of LED power is required to equal a 50 Watt
halogen. This has never been much of a mystery. Cheap LED lamps are jsut as
bad as cheap CFLs. Also no mystery.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97pk4uFhf5U3@mid.individual.net...
yaputya wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97nae3Fi1cU3@mid.individual.net...
Metro wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is
better for the environment and our pocket to replace (even
working) light bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although
these ones are being replaced orverseas with even newer ones that
are more environmental and economical at a cost of $20'ish each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a
high quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive. In 6
years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a wayward
possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I dropped onto
a rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used from between a few
minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are
used VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power
consumption. I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each
downlight is around $3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten
incandescent. It is used less than 1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........

**Just waiting for a suitable LED replacement.

LEDs ain't the ants pants either...
I recently bought a 5W 12VAC LED light in MR16 26deg. spotlight form
that was on special - I got for about AUD10. I thought it would run
much cooler than the halogen it replaces - well it does, but it still
gets hot enough to boil water.
It is somewhere between a 10W and 20W halogen in brightness, but while
an enclosed halogen bulb is happy to run hot without any heatsinking,
the LED needs a complex cast aluminium heatsink that gets very hot.
Turns out that these high power lighting LEDs dissipate around 85% of
the power in heat - so only low-power LEDs run cool. The hotter the
LED gets the shorter its life and the light output also goes down -
so your 10,000 hour 450 cd LED may not get anywhere near that if it
is running hot.
The bottom line is that light fittings designed for halogens may not
be suitable for LEDs due to inadequate ventilation. Beware !
The solution is to use fittings actually designed for LEDs and not to
retrofit LEDs into old halogen fittings.

**I am well aware of the issues and limitations associated with LEDs. I am
also aware that around 15 Watts of LED power is required to equal a 50
Watt halogen. This has never been much of a mystery. Cheap LED lamps are
jsut as bad as cheap CFLs. Also no mystery.
Click to expand...
I assume by 'lamp' you mean light fixture or luminaire.
The point is that although the LED array itself might be much more
efficient than a similar halogen, the luminaire has to be taken
into consideration when evaluating the overall efficiency - and
substituting LED arrays for halogen bulbs in ANY luminaire can
lead to overheating, regardless of "cheap" or "expensive".
 
yaputya wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97pk4uFhf5U3@mid.individual.net...
yaputya wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97nae3Fi1cU3@mid.individual.net...
Metro wrote:
"Trevor Wilson" <trevor@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:97k7kqFvj7U3@mid.individual.net...
Peter wrote:
Light bulbs used to cost $0.15-$1.50 then we were told it is
better for the environment and our pocket to replace (even
working) light bulbs with new ones that cost $5-$10 although
these ones are being replaced orverseas with even newer ones
that are more environmental and economical at a cost of $20'ish
each.

**Idiot. Let's examine some real world facts, as opposed to your
abject nonsense:

In my home, I have around 20 CFLs. MAXIMUM cost was $6.00 (for a
high quality, Philips 23 Watt). Most were much less expensive.
In 6 years, I've experienced TWO failures. One was caused by a
wayward possum and the other was in a 'trouble' lamp, which I
dropped onto a rock and punctured the tube. The CFLs are used
from between a few minutes per day and several hours per day.

I also have a dozen or so 50 Watt halogen downlights. These are
used VERY infrequently, due to the nonsensically high power
consumption. I've had 7 failures in 6 years. Cost of each
downlight is around $3.00. I have one, 100 Watt tungesten
incandescent. It is used less than 1
hour per month and has failed three times in 6 years. Replacement
cost was (last I purchased one) about $4.00. Unfortunately, the
light fitting is unsuitable for any other type of lamp.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Obviously you will change the fitting.........

**Just waiting for a suitable LED replacement.

LEDs ain't the ants pants either...
I recently bought a 5W 12VAC LED light in MR16 26deg. spotlight form
that was on special - I got for about AUD10. I thought it would run
much cooler than the halogen it replaces - well it does, but it
still gets hot enough to boil water.
It is somewhere between a 10W and 20W halogen in brightness, but
while an enclosed halogen bulb is happy to run hot without any
heatsinking, the LED needs a complex cast aluminium heatsink that
gets very hot. Turns out that these high power lighting LEDs
dissipate around 85% of the power in heat - so only low-power LEDs
run cool. The hotter the LED gets the shorter its life and the
light output also goes down - so your 10,000 hour 450 cd LED may
not get anywhere near that if it is running hot.
The bottom line is that light fittings designed for halogens may not
be suitable for LEDs due to inadequate ventilation. Beware !
The solution is to use fittings actually designed for LEDs and not
to retrofit LEDs into old halogen fittings.

**I am well aware of the issues and limitations associated with
LEDs. I am also aware that around 15 Watts of LED power is required
to equal a 50 Watt halogen. This has never been much of a mystery.
Cheap LED lamps are jsut as bad as cheap CFLs. Also no mystery.

I assume by 'lamp' you mean light fixture or luminaire.
Click to expand...
**Correct.

The point is that although the LED array itself might be much more
efficient than a similar halogen, the luminaire has to be taken
into consideration when evaluating the overall efficiency - and
substituting LED arrays for halogen bulbs in ANY luminaire can
lead to overheating, regardless of "cheap" or "expensive".
Click to expand...
**Of course. Many ignorant folk seem to think that LEDs run cool.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
 
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