~$50 DMM...

[George Herold]

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?

 

[Ricky]

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 6:06:14 PM UTC-5, George Herold wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

I had an Extech that I really liked because it was small, but very functional. However, they use these really cheesy banana jacks that solder surface mount, using a perpendicular point of contact, rather than bending the lead over and having a foot. So one broke off and I could never get it soldered back on.

I tried to order a new one, but these things have a half life like a laptop, some months, then they are discontinued and a new one takes it\'s place. Every unit I\'ve bought since then used colors on some of the text that is virtually illegible against the chosen background color. When they change the background, some other text is now done with disappearing ink! So I gave up!

The frequency and capacitance are a bit limited typically, but if you have nothing else... The temperature uses a thermocouple, which needs a reference temperature. If you want to measure 600°, you should be fine. If you want to measure room temperature, it will always read the same thing unless they use some reference. I remember reading a temperature that was dropping when I expected it to rise. My furnace had kicked on and was blowing on the meter!

Actually, $50 sounds a bit pricey to me. You can find good meters for $25-$35. Eevblog has discussions with lots of meters mentioned. You might ask there. They also review a lot of them and promote some. I\'m not sure if they actually worry about what they are promoting, so it may or may not be a recommendation. Or maybe your $50 meter has a good temperature reference, and is worth the money? It\'s really hard to tell with the Chinese brands..

--

Rick C.

- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?

I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

 

[George Herold]

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

 

[John Larkin]

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.

 

[piglet]

On 19/11/2022 23:06, George Herold wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?

Nice to hear from you again! My experience is that auto ranging can be
painfully slow and does not make it to my list of desirable features.
Neither is frequency nor duty cycle. Capacitance can be handy but DMMs
tend to have rather limited ranges. Many low end units only have DC
current but AC current (even if only LF) is a nice to have. Personally I
like to have more than one DMM to hand, the second unit can be very
low-end but seeing (for example) voltage and current simultaneously
without swapping probes etc is great. A clamp meter with AC/DC hall
effect current sensor is always in my toolbag, not much use at mA levels
but very handy for general troubleshooting.

piglet

 

[Joe Gwinn]

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
<jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.

Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil in
them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven. Not
useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which is
a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and so
can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I use
for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K wire
probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the TC,
it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp and
a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed with
borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten amps, and
then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn

 

[George Herold]

On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 5:10:59 PM UTC-5, Joe Gwinn wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.
Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil in
them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven. Not
useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which is
a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and so
can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I use
for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K wire
probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the TC,
it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp and
a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed with
borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten amps, and
then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn

Thanks, yeah totally getting the TC. Can you soft solder a type K TC? I use to use type T, easy to solder and not very magnetic. (Hmm maybe one for me and one for my son?)
George H.

 

[George Herold]

On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 7:53:00 AM UTC-5, erichp...@hotmail.com wrote:

On 19/11/2022 23:06, George Herold wrote:
Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
Nice to hear from you again! My experience is that auto ranging can be
painfully slow and does not make it to my list of desirable features.
Neither is frequency nor duty cycle. Capacitance can be handy but DMMs
tend to have rather limited ranges. Many low end units only have DC
current but AC current (even if only LF) is a nice to have. Personally I
like to have more than one DMM to hand, the second unit can be very
low-end but seeing (for example) voltage and current simultaneously
without swapping probes etc is great. A clamp meter with AC/DC hall
effect current sensor is always in my toolbag, not much use at mA levels
but very handy for general troubleshooting.

piglet

Thanks piglet, If there is a range button so you can turn off the autorange and just select one, then that works.
I think mostly my son will want to check continuity/ resistance and low DC voltages and maybe currents.
Nothing fancy just simple trouble shooting stuff.
I trust you have plenty of haycorns packed away for the winter. :^)
(2-3 feet of snow here and 5-6 just a few miles north of me. Lake effect in Buffalo, is fun and challenging.)

 

[Rich S]

[snip]

Hi George, Have you looked at eevblog spreadsheets?
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/multimeter-spreadsheet/
Its not that easy to use, and not that current (last edit, ca 2017)
the \"hand held\" spreadsheet is here (Excel or equiv app is required):
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/multimeter-spreadsheet/?action=dlattach;attach=1188318
Let me see if I can clean it up....
= RS

 

[Joe Gwinn]

On Sun, 20 Nov 2022 15:48:12 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 5:10:59 PM UTC-5, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.
Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil in
them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven. Not
useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which is
a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and so
can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I use
for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K wire
probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the TC,
it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp and
a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed with
borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten amps, and
then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn
Thanks, yeah totally getting the TC. Can you soft solder a type K TC? I use to use type T, easy to solder and not very magnetic. (Hmm maybe one for me and one for my son?)

Yes, you can solder Type K. I don\'t recall what flux I used, probably
plumbers grease flux. Good idea to clean the flux residue off before
use.

Joe Gwinn

 

[Rich S]

On Monday, November 21, 2022 at 12:25:44 AM UTC, Rich S wrote:

[snip]

Hi George, Have you looked at eevblog spreadsheets?
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/multimeter-spreadsheet/
Its not that easy to use, and not that current (last edit, ca 2017)
the \"hand held\" spreadsheet is here (Excel or equiv app is required):
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/multimeter-spreadsheet/?action=dlattach;attach=1188318
Let me see if I can clean it up....
= RS

cleaned up version is here
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-LmzNywKutQfQZCjPl9UPnKlV57EAVyaSE2UETEvVLk/edit?usp=sharing

IMHO Id get something thats likely stand up to many oops
and he can use for very many years, like a Fluke 101

cheers, RS

 

[bitrex]

On 11/19/2022 8:39 PM, George Herold wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

As an alternate consider the Amprobe AM220:

<https://www.amazon.com/Amprobe-AM-220-Compact-Digital-Multimeter/dp/B003Z7UMKI/>

What I like about it is it\'s a rugged meter, I\'ve been using one almost
daily for about 15 years and still going strong. The buttons and rotary
dial are solid and not made of that rubbery Chinesium crap that wears
out fast with use like the Klein Tools meter maybe has..

I believe the 220 is discontinued but looks like an Amazon reseller
still has some kicking around..

 

[Phil Hobbs]

George Herold wrote:

On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 5:10:59 PM UTC-5, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve
been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and
then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand
should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one
looks nice. Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto
Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency,
Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V ~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be
nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.
Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil
in them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven.
Not useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which
is a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and
so can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I
use for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K
wire probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the
TC, it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them
together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp
and a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed
with borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten
amps, and then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn
Thanks, yeah totally getting the TC. Can you soft solder a type K
TC? I use to use type T, easy to solder and not very magnetic. (Hmm
maybe one for me and one for my son?) George H.

Nope, chromel and alumel don\'t solder. Type T (copper/constantan) is a
good solderable system.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Joe Gwinn]

On Sun, 20 Nov 2022 20:45:08 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 5:10:59 PM UTC-5, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve
been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and
then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand
should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one
looks nice. Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto
Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency,
Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V ~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be
nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.
Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil
in them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven.
Not useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which
is a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and
so can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I
use for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K
wire probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the
TC, it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them
together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp
and a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed
with borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten
amps, and then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn
Thanks, yeah totally getting the TC. Can you soft solder a type K
TC? I use to use type T, easy to solder and not very magnetic. (Hmm
maybe one for me and one for my son?) George H.


Nope, chromel and alumel don\'t solder. Type T (copper/constantan) is a
good solderable system.

I\'d bet that tinners flux (HCL plus Zn) would work. Failing that,
stainless-steel (phosphoric acid) flux. Haven\'t needed to solder
Chromel-Alumel so far, but have soldered lots of stainless steel
hardware.

What also can help is to mechanically clean the surfaces under oil, to
keep oxygen away from the freshly cleaned surface to be soldered. This
also works on aluminum.

Joe Gwinn

 

[John S]

On 11/19/2022 6:06 PM, George Herold wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?

Got one. If that folded piece of paper is what they call a manual, it\'s
a stretch of the imagination.

It has a 1500mAh battery. Curious things about charging are:
* After normal use it will require 1 hour of charging.
* After it\'s fully run down it will 1 hour of charging.
* The wall wart charger capacity is 800mA.

--
Dogs make me happy. Humans make my head hurt.

 

[Phil Hobbs]

Joe Gwinn wrote:

On Sun, 20 Nov 2022 20:45:08 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 5:10:59 PM UTC-5, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve
been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and
then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand
should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one
looks nice. Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto
Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency,
Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V ~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be
nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.
Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil
in them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven.
Not useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which
is a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and
so can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I
use for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K
wire probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the
TC, it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them
together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp
and a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed
with borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten
amps, and then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn
Thanks, yeah totally getting the TC. Can you soft solder a type K
TC? I use to use type T, easy to solder and not very magnetic. (Hmm
maybe one for me and one for my son?) George H.


Nope, chromel and alumel don\'t solder. Type T (copper/constantan) is a
good solderable system.

I\'d bet that tinners flux (HCL plus Zn) would work. Failing that,
stainless-steel (phosphoric acid) flux. Haven\'t needed to solder
Chromel-Alumel so far, but have soldered lots of stainless steel
hardware.

What also can help is to mechanically clean the surfaces under oil, to
keep oxygen away from the freshly cleaned surface to be soldered. This
also works on aluminum.

Joe Gwinn

You\'re probably right that it can be done OK that way.

During the Battle of Britain, the RAF used to repair shot-up aircraft by
attaching Al plates using plumbing solder under oil, so that one has a
pretty good pedigree.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

 

[Joe Gwinn]

On Mon, 21 Nov 2022 15:12:14 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Sun, 20 Nov 2022 20:45:08 -0500, Phil Hobbs
pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

George Herold wrote:
On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 5:10:59 PM UTC-5, Joe Gwinn wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve
been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and
then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand
should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one
looks nice. Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto
Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency,
Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V ~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be
nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.
Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil
in them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven.
Not useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which
is a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and
so can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I
use for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K
wire probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the
TC, it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them
together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp
and a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed
with borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten
amps, and then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn
Thanks, yeah totally getting the TC. Can you soft solder a type K
TC? I use to use type T, easy to solder and not very magnetic. (Hmm
maybe one for me and one for my son?) George H.


Nope, chromel and alumel don\'t solder. Type T (copper/constantan) is a
good solderable system.

I\'d bet that tinners flux (HCL plus Zn) would work. Failing that,
stainless-steel (phosphoric acid) flux. Haven\'t needed to solder
Chromel-Alumel so far, but have soldered lots of stainless steel
hardware.

What also can help is to mechanically clean the surfaces under oil, to
keep oxygen away from the freshly cleaned surface to be soldered. This
also works on aluminum.

Joe Gwinn


You\'re probably right that it can be done OK that way.

During the Battle of Britain, the RAF used to repair shot-up aircraft by
attaching Al plates using plumbing solder under oil, so that one has a
pretty good pedigree.

Battle tested!

Plumbers\' grease flux contains zinc chloride and ammonium chloride in
petroleum grease, so it has more bite than radio solder.

I\'ve found tinners flux good for soldering battery holder terminals to
their riveted battery contacts. Apply with a wet toothpick. Rinse in
hot water when done.

Joe Gwinn

 

[piglet]

On 20/11/2022 23:54, George Herold wrote:

On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 7:53:00 AM UTC-5, erichp...@hotmail.com wrote:
On 19/11/2022 23:06, George Herold wrote:
Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
Nice to hear from you again! My experience is that auto ranging can be
painfully slow and does not make it to my list of desirable features.
Neither is frequency nor duty cycle. Capacitance can be handy but DMMs
tend to have rather limited ranges. Many low end units only have DC
current but AC current (even if only LF) is a nice to have. Personally I
like to have more than one DMM to hand, the second unit can be very
low-end but seeing (for example) voltage and current simultaneously
without swapping probes etc is great. A clamp meter with AC/DC hall
effect current sensor is always in my toolbag, not much use at mA levels
but very handy for general troubleshooting.

piglet

Thanks piglet, If there is a range button so you can turn off the autorange and just select one, then that works.
I think mostly my son will want to check continuity/ resistance and low DC voltages and maybe currents.
Nothing fancy just simple trouble shooting stuff.
I trust you have plenty of haycorns packed away for the winter. :^)
(2-3 feet of snow here and 5-6 just a few miles north of me. Lake effect in Buffalo, is fun and challenging.)

Thanks, yes foggy and cold here!

piglet

 

[piglet]

On 20/11/2022 22:10, Joe Gwinn wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:42:39 -0800, John Larkin
jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote:

On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 17:39:41 -0800 (PST), George Herold
ggherold@gmail.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 19, 2022 at 7:14:13 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2022 15:06:09 -0800 (PST), George Herold
gghe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi guys! Long time no smell.* I miss you guys, but I\'ve been doing almost zero electronics. (I lurk every now and then) So my son wants a cheapish DMM for Xmas. What brand should I look at? Extech? Searching this Klein tool one looks nice.
Klein Tools MM400 Multimeter, Digital Auto Ranging, AC/DC Voltage, Current, Capacitance, Frequency, Duty-Cycle, Diode, Continuity, Temp 600V
~$50 on amazon

George H.

*Did I recommend \"Emperor of Scent\" as a good read?
I\'ve been happy with extechs, for home use and teaching.

Thanks, Extech it is then... One with a TC probe would be nice.

Definitely get the TC. It\'s good for cooking too.

Yes. I do that too. Particularly useful for determining the
temperature of cast iron skillets, especially with a puddle of oil in
them. Also used to measure the air temperature inside the oven. Not
useful for broilers.

What I have been using since 2007 is an Extech model 421501, which is
a \"Type K Thermometer\". No problems so far. I bought it with a
penetration probe, but it has standard thermocouple sockets, and so
can be used with all manner of purchased or made probes. What I use
for the skillets et al is a homemade Teflon-insulated type K wire
probe about 2 meters long.

While one is supposed to weld the two wires together to take the TC,
it also works to twist them tightly and soft-solder them together.

One can weld the wires together using a 100-watt incandescent lamp and
a lump of carbon, drawing an arc between twisted wires (fluxed with
borax) and the carbon lump. The 100-watt lamp will pass ten amps, and
then drop to one amp.

Joe Gwinn

Yep, I very successfully welded TC junctions using a carbon rod (from a
old dry cell) and capacitor discharge arc. Cannot recall details, but
something like 200uF charged to 50V.

piglet