2x16 LCD display in battery powered application?

[No One Really]

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume 2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of power
consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of 2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

TIA

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:57:05 +0200, the renowned "No One Really"
<noone@really.org> wrote:

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume 2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of power
consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of 2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

TIA

The typical supply current of the latest generation controller chip
alone is 0.35mA (0.6mA maximum), and there is usually another driver
chip (1mA maximum), so I'd guess that the answer is "not a hope in
hell".



Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

 

[Sylvain Munaut]

No One Really wrote:

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume 2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of power
consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of 2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

One 2500mAh AA battery is 2500mAh * 1.25v = 3125mWh
So with two cell your power budget is 6250mWh

Let's say your power supply has a 90% conversion efficiency (to convert
from the 1.25v or 2.5v to your final application voltage).

That means you only have 5625mWh of usable power for 1 year (=8760h).
So your mean instantaneous power consumption must be lower than 0.64 mW.
Assuming a 3.3v vcc that's about 200ľA.


So in short ... you'd better find better batteries and very low power
LCD. 200ľA is not much of current to play with.



Sylvain

 

[Mochuelo]

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:57:05 +0200, "No One Really" <noone@really.org>
wrote:

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume 2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of power
consumption.

You may have thought about this, but couldn't you use a PMOS to turn
off the LCD most of the time? If the user wants to see the
information, s/he can just push a button momentarily. Then it would
stay on until a timer expires.

Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of 2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

TIA

 

[No One Really]

"Sylvain Munaut" <com.246tNt@tnt> wrote in message
news:42fba7fd$0$17152$ba620e4c@news.skynet.be...

No One Really wrote:
I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery
powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal
that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume
2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing
is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of
power
consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of
2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current
consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure
if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display
contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

One 2500mAh AA battery is 2500mAh * 1.25v = 3125mWh
So with two cell your power budget is 6250mWh

Let's say your power supply has a 90% conversion efficiency (to convert
from the 1.25v or 2.5v to your final application voltage).

That means you only have 5625mWh of usable power for 1 year (=8760h).
So your mean instantaneous power consumption must be lower than 0.64 mW.
Assuming a 3.3v vcc that's about 200ľA.


So in short ... you'd better find better batteries and very low power
LCD. 200ľA is not much of current to play with.

It's a 5V system so that would translate into 128uA (0.128mA). I read a
datasheet from Rohm which claims their LCD module will use typically 0.5mA
so that will translate into only about 2months of operation and possibly
less since I didn't take into account power usage of the microcontroller.

So how would one go about this? Is it just about segments? Segmented LCD
displays (with custom symbols and all that) ussually only consume microamps.
Are there no character or graphic LCD displays out there with very low power
consumption?

 

[No One Really]

"Mochuelo" <cucafera@RE_MO_VE_THIStelefonica.net> wrote in message
news:ngenf1dfsd7p9alhveefuqful8nmde1qsl@4ax.com...

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:57:05 +0200, "No One Really" <noone@really.org
wrote:

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery
powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal that
it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume 2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of
power
consumption.

You may have thought about this, but couldn't you use a PMOS to turn
off the LCD most of the time? If the user wants to see the
information, s/he can just push a button momentarily. Then it would
stay on until a timer expires.

Yes, a good idea. That seems to be the only sensible solution at this point.
I believe the display driving circuitry can be turned off in software so
that will cut consumption at least in half but most likely it will not
disable the logic part. By disabling the Chips Select line I may be able to
completely turn off the module (including logic) if I'm lucky (anyone know
this?). Otherwise I would need to redesign it to power the LCD module from a
MCU I/O line.

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 23:44:28 +0200, the renowned "No One Really"
<noone@really.org> wrote:

Yes, a good idea. That seems to be the only sensible solution at this point.
I believe the display driving circuitry can be turned off in software so
that will cut consumption at least in half but most likely it will not
disable the logic part. By disabling the Chips Select line I may be able to
completely turn off the module (including logic) if I'm lucky (anyone know
this?). Otherwise I would need to redesign it to power the LCD module from a
MCU I/O line.

I think you'll need to do the latter. It's better anyway, there is no
real reset line on those things.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

 

[Sylvain Munaut]

It's a 5V system so that would translate into 128uA (0.128mA). I read a
datasheet from Rohm which claims their LCD module will use typically 0.5mA
so that will translate into only about 2months of operation and possibly
less since I didn't take into account power usage of the microcontroller.

I think a big part of the power if for the logic. On custom display, you
often have 1 dataline per 'symbol', the controller is not included. Here
the display needs to be refreshed constantly and there is the char ram
etc ...

So how would one go about this? Is it just about segments? Segmented LCD
displays (with custom symbols and all that) ussually only consume microamps.
Are there no character or graphic LCD displays out there with very low power
consumption?

As suggested in another post, the panel might not need to be powered all
the time. Cutting the whole power would be better.

Depending on space constraint, you can find better batteries. One D
sized cell might give you > 8500mAh.

Or some camcorder battery pack are like 7.2V with >2000mAh.

Add a solar panel ?


Sylvain

 

[artie]

In article <1123796863.6547fbbab28c90bab72d5b7c00d3e6fa@teranews>, No
One Really <noone@really.org> wrote:

"Mochuelo" <cucafera@RE_MO_VE_THIStelefonica.net> wrote in message
news:ngenf1dfsd7p9alhveefuqful8nmde1qsl@4ax.com...
On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:57:05 +0200, "No One Really" <noone@really.org
wrote:

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery
powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal that
it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume 2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of
power
consumption.

You may have thought about this, but couldn't you use a PMOS to turn
off the LCD most of the time? If the user wants to see the
information, s/he can just push a button momentarily. Then it would
stay on until a timer expires.


Yes, a good idea. That seems to be the only sensible solution at this point.
I believe the display driving circuitry can be turned off in software so
that will cut consumption at least in half but most likely it will not
disable the logic part. By disabling the Chips Select line I may be able to
completely turn off the module (including logic) if I'm lucky (anyone know
this?). Otherwise I would need to redesign it to power the LCD module from a
MCU I/O line.

You may be confusing a number of different things here -- the LCD
itself (*without* drivers) is a very low power device. Add the usual
controller chip, and you've got a different story entirely.

Powering down the display when it's not in use will save power, at the
added complexity on the software side of having to reinitialize the
display when you power it up (that includes the fancy song-and-dance
needed to put 8-bit data path controllers into 4-bit mode if you're
trying to save on pins as well as on power), and the additional
milliseconds that setup and initialization requires.


--
Namaste--

 

[Roger Hamlett]

"No One Really" <noone@really.org> wrote in message
news:1123796605.97410bec582dd8f1ae8704ab3786b352@teranews...

"Sylvain Munaut" <com.246tNt@tnt> wrote in message
news:42fba7fd$0$17152$ba620e4c@news.skynet.be...
No One Really wrote:
I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery
powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal
that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume
2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all
processing
is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of
power
consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption
of
2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current
consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not
sure
if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display
contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in
a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA
batteries?

One 2500mAh AA battery is 2500mAh * 1.25v = 3125mWh
So with two cell your power budget is 6250mWh

Let's say your power supply has a 90% conversion efficiency (to convert
from the 1.25v or 2.5v to your final application voltage).

That means you only have 5625mWh of usable power for 1 year (=8760h).
So your mean instantaneous power consumption must be lower than 0.64
mW.
Assuming a 3.3v vcc that's about 200ľA.


So in short ... you'd better find better batteries and very low power
LCD. 200ľA is not much of current to play with.

It's a 5V system so that would translate into 128uA (0.128mA). I read a
datasheet from Rohm which claims their LCD module will use typically
0.5mA
so that will translate into only about 2months of operation and possibly
less since I didn't take into account power usage of the
microcontroller.

So how would one go about this? Is it just about segments? Segmented LCD
displays (with custom symbols and all that) ussually only consume
microamps.
Are there no character or graphic LCD displays out there with very low
power
consumption?
It is about segments. Getting rid of them (or more accurately, the number

of clock lines)!...
Basically, all graphic LCD's are multiplexed. If you take the 16*2
alphanumeric example, there are potentially 5*7*16*2 segments on such a
display, that need to be accessed. 1120 segments. If you go graphic, it
gets even worse. I had a custom display made for an application, with 256
segments, and with two row direct drive, the consumption was in the order
you require. However it meant having in my case 128 segment lines, and two
clocks. Using fourteen segment characters, allowed me to have twelve
characters, six decimal points, and then still have a large numner of
custom message/symbols. Custom LCD's like this are not expensive now, but
involve a huge number of interconnections. Even using zebra strip
mounting, you will run out of possible connections for a display with 16*2
full alpha characters...
The more clock lines you have, the more power is used. With a 16*2 module,
there will normally be 80 segment drives, and fourteen clocks. The best
chips driving this sort of number of segments, will still draw perhaps
1uA/segment line, and typically 20uA/clock line, depending on the speed
used for the multiplexing. Even ignoring the consumption for other parts
of the chip, this still takes you past your continuous consumption
requirement.
Could you use a low number of digits for continuous display (like a 4
digit LCD, with a couple of enunciators), and a smaller text LCD for
'messages', only enabled when required?. This is achievable, and
relatively simple to do.

Best Wishes

 

[Rich Grise]

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 23:40:10 +0200, No One Really wrote:

So how would one go about this? Is it just about segments? Segmented LCD
displays (with custom symbols and all that) ussually only consume
microamps. Are there no character or graphic LCD displays out there with
very low power consumption?

FWIW, I have a little credit-card-sized calculator, and its only power
source is a photovoltaic cell on the front. It forgets everything in
the dark, and the display goes off, but while it's in use, it seems
to work fine.

Good Luck!
Rich

 

[Paul Hovnanian P.E.]

No One Really wrote:

"Sylvain Munaut" <com.246tNt@tnt> wrote in message
news:42fba7fd$0$17152$ba620e4c@news.skynet.be...
No One Really wrote:
I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery
powered
device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal
that it
should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume
2500mAh
per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing
is
done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of
power
consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of
2x16
character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current
consumption
for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure
if
the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display
contents
changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

One 2500mAh AA battery is 2500mAh * 1.25v = 3125mWh
So with two cell your power budget is 6250mWh

Let's say your power supply has a 90% conversion efficiency (to convert
from the 1.25v or 2.5v to your final application voltage).

That means you only have 5625mWh of usable power for 1 year (=8760h).
So your mean instantaneous power consumption must be lower than 0.64 mW.
Assuming a 3.3v vcc that's about 200ľA.


So in short ... you'd better find better batteries and very low power
LCD. 200ľA is not much of current to play with.

It's a 5V system so that would translate into 128uA (0.128mA). I read a
datasheet from Rohm which claims their LCD module will use typically 0.5mA
so that will translate into only about 2months of operation and possibly
less since I didn't take into account power usage of the microcontroller.

So how would one go about this? Is it just about segments? Segmented LCD
displays (with custom symbols and all that) ussually only consume microamps.
Are there no character or graphic LCD displays out there with very low power
consumption?

De-energize the display and driver circuitry until the operator pushes a
'display' button.

--
Paul Hovnanian mailtoaul@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
Time's fun when you're having flies. -- Kermit the Frog

 

[Adam S]

No One Really wrote:

"Sylvain Munaut" <com.246tNt@tnt> wrote in message
news:42fba7fd$0$17152$ba620e4c@news.skynet.be...

No One Really wrote:

I'm using one of those 2x16 alphanumeric LCD displays in a battery

powered

device but I'm unsure about the power consumption. I've set the goal

that it

should work for about a year on two AA alkaline batteries (assume

2500mAh

per AA battery). As the MCU is mostly in sleep mode and all processing

is

done on an interrupt basis, the LCD display is the primary source of

power

consumption. Now looking at several datasheets the powerconsumption of

2x16

character LCD's varies between 0.4mA to 10mA. Sometimes current

consumption

for both the logic and the LCD driving is specificied but I'm not sure

if

the logic is always consuming current or just when the LCD display

contents

changes/refreshes.

Has anyone have any experience with using 2x16 character displays in a
battery powered product? Could it be made to last for 1 year when the
display is on continuously assuming the use of two 2500mAH AA batteries?

One 2500mAh AA battery is 2500mAh * 1.25v = 3125mWh
So with two cell your power budget is 6250mWh

Let's say your power supply has a 90% conversion efficiency (to convert
from the 1.25v or 2.5v to your final application voltage).

That means you only have 5625mWh of usable power for 1 year (=8760h).
So your mean instantaneous power consumption must be lower than 0.64 mW.
Assuming a 3.3v vcc that's about 200ľA.


So in short ... you'd better find better batteries and very low power
LCD. 200ľA is not much of current to play with.


It's a 5V system so that would translate into 128uA (0.128mA). I read a
datasheet from Rohm which claims their LCD module will use typically 0.5mA
so that will translate into only about 2months of operation and possibly
less since I didn't take into account power usage of the microcontroller.

I was recently playing around with some LCD character modules (16x2
large, and 40x2 standard), and even though the data sheet specified +5V
for VDD-VSS, I was able to run them to 2.3V without problems, and if not
communicating, then they worked down to 1.8V before the display went
stupid. Of course the LCD voltage (VDD-VL) bust be maintained at around
5V. I didn't measure current in the VL pin.