2nd try - ABB inverter schematic

[Dave H.]

Hi, I have an ABB ACS-301-4P9-3 VFD invertor that I would like to get a
schematic for - it was dropped (hard!) by the UPS man, and all appears to be
working except the programming panel and display - so I can't configure it
for the motor I'm using!

Some investigation revealed that there's no DC to the panel, cable and
connectors checked and OK, and rather than dive in to the (surface mount)
board blind, I could really use a schematic for the main (processor) board,
or the whole thing! The man at ABB's agent in t he UK says "It's obsolete,
and we wouldn't have repaired it anyway, so no service info - buy a new
one!"

I've tried on rec.crafts.metalworking, no joy there...

Any help would be really appreciated,

Dave H.

 

[D Yuniskis]

Dave H. wrote:

Hi, I have an ABB ACS-301-4P9-3 VFD invertor that I would like to get a
schematic for - it was dropped (hard!) by the UPS man, and all appears to be
working except the programming panel and display - so I can't configure it
for the motor I'm using!

Some investigation revealed that there's no DC to the panel, cable and

It should be relatively easy to trace power back to the power
supply -- even if it comes via the "main board", etc.

Start at the power supply and verify you have the "expected"
voltages (whatever they might be). If the PS is shot, then
a schematic of the main board is only useful as toilet paper...

The good news is PS tend to be easier to fix than "logic".
OTOH, if the PS is integrated and serves the VFD as well,
be prepared for some potential heartache.

connectors checked and OK, and rather than dive in to the (surface mount)
board blind, I could really use a schematic for the main (processor) board,
or the whole thing! The man at ABB's agent in t he UK says "It's obsolete,
and we wouldn't have repaired it anyway, so no service info - buy a new
one!"

 

[Jamie]

Dave H. wrote:

Hi, I have an ABB ACS-301-4P9-3 VFD invertor that I would like to get a
schematic for - it was dropped (hard!) by the UPS man, and all appears to be
working except the programming panel and display - so I can't configure it
for the motor I'm using!

Some investigation revealed that there's no DC to the panel, cable and
connectors checked and OK, and rather than dive in to the (surface mount)
board blind, I could really use a schematic for the main (processor) board,
or the whole thing! The man at ABB's agent in t he UK says "It's obsolete,
and we wouldn't have repaired it anyway, so no service info - buy a new
one!"

I've tried on rec.crafts.metalworking, no joy there...

Any help would be really appreciated,

Dave H.



Being obsolete should tell you something...

the small line of ABB drives are not very good for the
price they're asking..

You can get a VS1MD from Baldor that does 1 Hp up to
30 HP. the 1hp is around $330 for a 480 3 phase type.
(Don't believe the pricing you see on their site)

These little drives have a lot of operating abilities how
ever, if one should go bad, beyond a simple obvious visual
defect that can be corrected, its in the bin it goes.

 

[Dave H.]

"Jamie" wrote...

Being obsolete should tell you something...

the small line of ABB drives are not very good for the
price they're asking..

You can get a VS1MD from Baldor that does 1 Hp up to
30 HP. the 1hp is around $330 for a 480 3 phase type.
(Don't believe the pricing you see on their site)

These little drives have a lot of operating abilities how
ever, if one should go bad, beyond a simple obvious visual
defect that can be corrected, its in the bin it goes.

Hi Jamie,

I think it's probably obsolete because parts have become smaller and much
cheaper over the years? The ACS300 does everything the newer ones do, but in
a larger case and seemingly with no spares or support beyond an installers'
and operators' manual.

My main objection (other than preferring to repair and re-use rather than
send to landfill) to buying a new VFD is that the ABB is easily hacked to
fool it into thinking it has 415V 3-phase input when all I have is 240V
single-phase (I've done a mod to the input, now a voltage-doubler) - newer
ones use 600V or so electrolytics across the input rectifier whereas the
older ones have 2 off 380V rated cap's in series, with a convenient rail to
put the neutral line onto... With the 3-phase, 3-speed (multi-winding) 3HP
415V-only motor in my lathe it's way less hassle and expense to fix the VFD
I've got than replace with new - 240v to 415v converting VFDs here in the UK
start at around Ł500 / $800, more if you want anything over 2HP... and
that's more than I've spent (so far) on the lathe and VFD combined

I could just use it as-is (it powers the motor OK and the fwd/rev and
variable speed work), but I'd like to set the motor parameters to match and
sort out braking etc. - which needs a working programming panel!

I guess it's out with the AVO, stereo 'scope and soldering iron if no-one
can suggest a source for the service manual or schematic - rats!

Dave H.
--
(The engineer formerly known as Homeless)

"Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men" -
Douglas Bader

 

[Jamie]

Dave H. wrote:

"Jamie" wrote...


Being obsolete should tell you something...

the small line of ABB drives are not very good for the
price they're asking..

You can get a VS1MD from Baldor that does 1 Hp up to
30 HP. the 1hp is around $330 for a 480 3 phase type.
(Don't believe the pricing you see on their site)

These little drives have a lot of operating abilities how
ever, if one should go bad, beyond a simple obvious visual
defect that can be corrected, its in the bin it goes.




Hi Jamie,

I think it's probably obsolete because parts have become smaller and much
cheaper over the years? The ACS300 does everything the newer ones do, but in
a larger case and seemingly with no spares or support beyond an installers'
and operators' manual.

My main objection (other than preferring to repair and re-use rather than
send to landfill) to buying a new VFD is that the ABB is easily hacked to
fool it into thinking it has 415V 3-phase input when all I have is 240V
single-phase (I've done a mod to the input, now a voltage-doubler) - newer
ones use 600V or so electrolytics across the input rectifier whereas the
older ones have 2 off 380V rated cap's in series, with a convenient rail to
put the neutral line onto... With the 3-phase, 3-speed (multi-winding) 3HP
415V-only motor in my lathe it's way less hassle and expense to fix the VFD
I've got than replace with new - 240v to 415v converting VFDs here in the UK
start at around Ł500 / $800, more if you want anything over 2HP... and
that's more than I've spent (so far) on the lathe and VFD combined

I could just use it as-is (it powers the motor OK and the fwd/rev and
variable speed work), but I'd like to set the motor parameters to match and
sort out braking etc. - which needs a working programming panel!

I guess it's out with the AVO, stereo 'scope and soldering iron if no-one
can suggest a source for the service manual or schematic - rats!

Dave H.
you could always try the software used to program them. it may work..

As for those units working on single phase. A lot of the micro
inverter drives allows you to operate on A and B phases. Some you need
to make sure you turn off the Phase loss fault condition so the drive
will ignore it.. When you do this, you will get 3 phase out, how ever,
the drive will not do its max rating. You just need to have a little
head room on the drive.

 

[Dave H.]

"Jamie" wrote...

you could always try the software used to program them. it may work..

As for those units working on single phase. A lot of the micro inverter
drives allows you to operate on A and B phases. Some you need to make sure
you turn off the Phase loss fault condition so the drive will ignore it..
When you do this, you will get 3 phase out, how ever, the drive will not
do its max rating. You just need to have a little head room on the drive.

If there *were* any progamming software, perhaps... and there's no
programming interface other than the (currently dead) front panel, apart
from a bus into the microcontroller which I don't have an interface for !

The issue isn't the single-phase input, it's the conversion from 240V to
415V, which the newer VFDs won't do, as the input capacitors are straight
across the rectifiers and hence can't be rewired into a voltage-doubler. The
ABB I have is rated for 5HP on 415V 3-phase, so is fine running a 3HP motor
from (doubled) 240V single-phase.

Thanks anyhow,
Dave H.
--
(The engineer formerly known as Homeless)

"Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men" -
Douglas Bader

 

[Dave H.]

"Dave H." wrote...

Hi, I have an ABB ACS-301-4P9-3 VFD invertor that I would like to get a
schematic for - it was dropped (hard!) by the UPS man, and all appears to
be
working except the programming panel and display - so I can't configure it
for the motor I'm using!

Some investigation revealed that there's no DC to the panel, cable and
connectors checked and OK, and rather than dive in to the (surface mount)
board blind, I could really use a schematic for the main (processor)
board,
or the whole thing! The man at ABB's agent in t he UK says "It's obsolete,
and we wouldn't have repaired it anyway, so no service info - buy a new
one!"

I've tried on rec.crafts.metalworking, no joy there...

Any help would be really appreciated,

All sorted now, after some resoldering under the connector for the
programmer - thanks all for the advice!

If anyone has the spec. for braking resistors for this (or very similar)
drive, it would be handy - according to the book for another ABB drive (same
rating, a few years newer) I'm looking at a 32 Ohm, 12 KW peak resistor if I
want "heavy duty" (emergency stop from top speed) braking... I may have to
Improvise!

Dave H.
--
(The engineer formerly known as Homeless)

"Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men" -
Douglas Bader

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

"Dave H." wrote:

All sorted now, after some resoldering under the connector for the
programmer - thanks all for the advice!

If anyone has the spec. for braking resistors for this (or very similar)
drive, it would be handy - according to the book for another ABB drive (same
rating, a few years newer) I'm looking at a 32 Ohm, 12 KW peak resistor if I
want "heavy duty" (emergency stop from top speed) braking... I may have to
Improvise!

Ask on the metalworking group.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.