1500-watt extended heater cord is hot.

T

Tibur Waltson

Guest
I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for
a Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the
cord is hot to the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But
the cord is not hot if I use a normal distance cord design for the
heater. How do I extend the heater cord twice the distance
without getting the cord hot?

TIA,
 
Tibur Waltson wrote:
I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for
a Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the
cord is hot to the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But
the cord is not hot if I use a normal distance cord design for the
heater. How do I extend the heater cord twice the distance
without getting the cord hot?
Click to expand...
The cause of many a fire and death.

Use much larger cord. Continuous duty (over 3 hours) derate the
cable to 80% of normal. Personally, I *never* use anything smaller
than 10AWG cable for electric heat. Considering the life-safety
implications the added cost falls away to meaninglessness (in
my world, anyway.) If you're running hundreds of feet, 10AWG might
not be adequate either.
 
In article <d8aaccbb2394d9b0f2feecec7e81c48e@news.bubbanews.com>,
"Tibur Waltson" <Toush@hi.com> wrote:

I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for
a Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the
cord is hot to the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But
the cord is not hot if I use a normal distance cord design for the
heater. How do I extend the heater cord twice the distance
without getting the cord hot?
Click to expand...
So you've now moved from trying to put two coils on your car or
jump-start it with a welder, to trying to burn your house down by
improper use of extension cords with electric heaters...

Dude, you're a disaster looking for a place to happen. There's only
possible thing to say about you: You're fucking NUTS! I take that
back... maybe there are two things: You're a troll, and a particularly
inept one.

Investigation/exploration/experimentation is one thing, but the crap
you're pulling outta your ass is neither. It's sheer stupid in action,
and quite likely to get somebody killed. I'll look for you on the Darwin
Awards. Hopefully, your award will come soon, before you kill an
innocent bystander with yet another of your half-baked, hare-brinaed
ideas.

--
Don Bruder - dakidd@sonic.net <--- Preferred Email - SpamAssassinated.
Hate SPAM? See <http://www.spamassassin.org> for some seriously great info.
I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart
Fly trap info pages: <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd/Horses/FlyTrap/index.html>
 
"Don Bruder" <dakidd@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:jsbRb.10914$XF6.218254@typhoon.sonic.net...
In article <d8aaccbb2394d9b0f2feecec7e81c48e@news.bubbanews.com>,
"Tibur Waltson" <Toush@hi.com> wrote:

I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for
a Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the
cord is hot to the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But
the cord is not hot if I use a normal distance cord design for the
heater. How do I extend the heater cord twice the distance
without getting the cord hot?

So you've now moved from trying to put two coils on your car or
jump-start it with a welder, to trying to burn your house down by
improper use of extension cords with electric heaters...

Dude, you're a disaster looking for a place to happen. There's only
possible thing to say about you: You're fucking NUTS! I take that
back... maybe there are two things: You're a troll, and a particularly
inept one.

Investigation/exploration/experimentation is one thing, but the crap
you're pulling outta your ass is neither. It's sheer stupid in action,
and quite likely to get somebody killed. I'll look for you on the Darwin
Awards. Hopefully, your award will come soon, before you kill an
innocent bystander with yet another of your half-baked, hare-brinaed
ideas.
Click to expand...
An extension cord for a heater is 'half-baked, hare brinaed'? Thats harsh.

Its something that alot of folks would try to do. The fact that he is asking
is a good sign, and allows the folks who really understand this stuff (not
me, unfortunately) to weigh in.

I'm a bit confused by this too. If you double the length of your wire, you
double the resistance (since R = rho * length/cross sectional area). Since
rho is fixed for copper at 10.4, and the area for a given mil (probably #16)
is fixed, R is proportional to length.

Because of this, and the fact that power dissipated by a wire is I^2R, the
power dissipated is proportional to the length.

I would guess that the ability of a wire to dissipate heat is also dependent
on the length, since its almost certainly proportional to the surface area
of the wire. However, this is where I'm probably wrong. Its probably the
case that much of the heat is dissipated by connections to the ends, and
consequently, while heat generation is constant along the length of the
cord, the heat dissipation is non-linear wrt length...

However, without proper knoweledge of the mechanisms behind heat dissipation
in power cords, I would simply rely on a pre-built cord that was designed to
handle 1500W. The following article has some interesting facts.

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/16.html

Here is a fairly cheap cord that will work properly, I think:

<http://tools.mainseek.com/333R16P789K9-Coleman-Cable-02509-100'-12/3-SJTW-O
range-Extension-Cord.html>

Regards,
Bob Monsen
 
In article <e7jRb.154905$I06.1573351@attbi_s01>,
"Robert C Monsen" <rcsurname@comcast.net> wrote:

"Don Bruder" <dakidd@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:jsbRb.10914$XF6.218254@typhoon.sonic.net...
In article <d8aaccbb2394d9b0f2feecec7e81c48e@news.bubbanews.com>,
"Tibur Waltson" <Toush@hi.com> wrote:

I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for
a Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the
cord is hot to the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But
the cord is not hot if I use a normal distance cord design for the
heater. How do I extend the heater cord twice the distance
without getting the cord hot?

So you've now moved from trying to put two coils on your car or
jump-start it with a welder, to trying to burn your house down by
improper use of extension cords with electric heaters...

Dude, you're a disaster looking for a place to happen. There's only
possible thing to say about you: You're fucking NUTS! I take that
back... maybe there are two things: You're a troll, and a particularly
inept one.

Investigation/exploration/experimentation is one thing, but the crap
you're pulling outta your ass is neither. It's sheer stupid in action,
and quite likely to get somebody killed. I'll look for you on the Darwin
Awards. Hopefully, your award will come soon, before you kill an
innocent bystander with yet another of your half-baked, hare-brinaed
ideas.


An extension cord for a heater is 'half-baked, hare brinaed'? Thats harsh.

Its something that alot of folks would try to do. The fact that he is asking
is a good sign, and allows the folks who really understand this stuff (not
me, unfortunately) to weigh in.
Click to expand...
Harsh? Perhaps. If so, it's no more harsh than the likely results of the
screwball ideas that this accident-looking-for-a-place-to-happen has
been floating in the past few weeks, under the guise of "investigating"
and "experimenting". So yes, "half-baked and hare-brained" (and do
please pardon my transposed "n" and "a" in the first posting) seems
quite appropriate to me.

--
Don Bruder - dakidd@sonic.net <--- Preferred Email - SpamAssassinated.
Hate SPAM? See <http://www.spamassassin.org> for some seriously great info.
I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart
Fly trap info pages: <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd/Horses/FlyTrap/index.html>
 
"Don Bruder" <dakidd@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:KOmRb.11005$XF6.220389@typhoon.sonic.net...
In article <e7jRb.154905$I06.1573351@attbi_s01>,
"Robert C Monsen" <rcsurname@comcast.net> wrote:

"Don Bruder" <dakidd@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:jsbRb.10914$XF6.218254@typhoon.sonic.net...
In article <d8aaccbb2394d9b0f2feecec7e81c48e@news.bubbanews.com>,
"Tibur Waltson" <Toush@hi.com> wrote:

I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for
a Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the
cord is hot to the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But
the cord is not hot if I use a normal distance cord design for the
heater. How do I extend the heater cord twice the distance
without getting the cord hot?

So you've now moved from trying to put two coils on your car or
jump-start it with a welder, to trying to burn your house down by
improper use of extension cords with electric heaters...

Dude, you're a disaster looking for a place to happen. There's only
possible thing to say about you: You're fucking NUTS! I take that
back... maybe there are two things: You're a troll, and a particularly
inept one.

Investigation/exploration/experimentation is one thing, but the crap
you're pulling outta your ass is neither. It's sheer stupid in action,
and quite likely to get somebody killed. I'll look for you on the
Darwin
Awards. Hopefully, your award will come soon, before you kill an
innocent bystander with yet another of your half-baked, hare-brinaed
ideas.


An extension cord for a heater is 'half-baked, hare brinaed'? Thats
harsh.

Its something that alot of folks would try to do. The fact that he is
asking
is a good sign, and allows the folks who really understand this stuff
(not
me, unfortunately) to weigh in.

Harsh? Perhaps. If so, it's no more harsh than the likely results of the
screwball ideas that this accident-looking-for-a-place-to-happen has
been floating in the past few weeks, under the guise of "investigating"
and "experimenting". So yes, "half-baked and hare-brained" (and do
please pardon my transposed "n" and "a" in the first posting) seems
Click to expand...
Oh, I thought it was dialect... sounded Scottish...

I'm guessing that a large number of the floor heaters sold in the US are
used with improper extension cords, probably old lamp extensions. Its
totally unsafe, and causes fires. Therefore, posting some information
regarding this makes perfect sense.

Also, the basics newsgroup is for these kinds of questions. You don't want
to scare off newbies.

Flaming responses such as yours should be reserved for important political
or gun control discussions on sci.electronics.design. ;)

Regards,
Bob Monsen
 
In article <jsbRb.10914$XF6.218254@typhoon.sonic.net>, dakidd@sonic.net
says...
Dude, you're a disaster looking for a place to happen. There's only
possible thing to say about you: You're fucking NUTS! I take that
back... maybe there are two things: You're a troll, and a particularly
inept one.

Investigation/exploration/experimentation is one thing, but the crap
you're pulling outta your ass is neither. It's sheer stupid in action,
and quite likely to get somebody killed. I'll look for you on the Darwin
Awards. Hopefully, your award will come soon, before you kill an
innocent bystander with yet another of your half-baked, hare-brinaed
ideas.
Click to expand...
Hey...If you drive a Ford you will try anything to get it
started in cold weather.
 
Tibur Waltson wrote;
"I use twice the cord of the same type for twice the distance for a
Sears portable 1500-watt heater. The problem is that the cord is hot to
the touch when we use it for a hour or more. But the cord is not hot if
I use a normal distance cord design for the heater. How do I extend the
heater cord twice the distance without getting the cord hot?"
____________________________________
Re;
Not much info Tibur... What size is the cord? You know; the "gauge
number"? It is doubtful that the extension you are using is of the same
size/material (same size conductor) if the cord temperatures are
appreciably different. It sounds like you're using a #16 or #14 cord.
The #16 would have a dissipation of about 1.3W/ft of twin conductor
cord, making it quite warm (especially if coiled or covered by a rug or
such); the #14 would have about 0.8W/ft. To be safe, I wouldn't use
anything smaller than a #12 extension; the suggestion of #10 is even
better.
Having said that, I was under the impression that most, if not all,
portable heater manufacturers advise against the use of "extension"
cords for their heaters in the owners manual.

-Dan Akers
 
Zipperhead wrote:

In article <jsbRb.10914$XF6.218254@typhoon.sonic.net>, dakidd@sonic.net
says...

Dude, you're a disaster looking for a place to happen. There's only
possible thing to say about you: You're fucking NUTS! I take that
back... maybe there are two things: You're a troll, and a particularly
inept one.

Investigation/exploration/experimentation is one thing, but the crap
you're pulling outta your ass is neither. It's sheer stupid in action,
and quite likely to get somebody killed. I'll look for you on the Darwin
Awards. Hopefully, your award will come soon, before you kill an
innocent bystander with yet another of your half-baked, hare-brinaed
ideas.

Hey...If you drive a Ford you will try anything to get it
started in cold weather.
Click to expand...
I do, and in northern Michigan have never had a problem getting
any of them started. Of course I use the recommended oil, 5W30,
and a fresh battery every fall, and regularly add dry gas (I
prefer the alcohol variety) to the tank.

A block heater might be nice, but not at the expense of burning
the place down. Home Depot has 10AWG extension cords at what
appears to me to be reasonable prices.
 
In article <QPmdnS6amqMRUovdRVn-uQ@comcast.com>,
bill9north@hotmailDITCHTHIS.com says...
Zipperhead wrote:

Hey...If you drive a Ford you will try anything to get it
started in cold weather.

I do, and in northern Michigan have never had a problem getting
any of them started. Of course I use the recommended oil, 5W30,
and a fresh battery every fall, and regularly add dry gas (I
prefer the alcohol variety) to the tank.

A block heater might be nice, but not at the expense of burning
the place down. Home Depot has 10AWG extension cords at what
appears to me to be reasonable prices.
Click to expand...
Well I live in Edmonton Alberta. The low tonite is forcast at
-35C . I have a block heater and charger on the battery.

My extention corn runs from the back of the house out across
the sidewalk. I felt the cord.

Nothing feels warm at all. Can I say " Cold as a witches tit".
 
In article <101dl7l3kgckd02@corp.supernews.com>, warf@compusmart.ab.ca
says...
In article <QPmdnS6amqMRUovdRVn-uQ@comcast.com>,
bill9north@hotmailDITCHTHIS.com says...

Zipperhead wrote:

Hey...If you drive a Ford you will try anything to get it
started in cold weather.

I do, and in northern Michigan have never had a problem getting
any of them started. Of course I use the recommended oil, 5W30,
and a fresh battery every fall, and regularly add dry gas (I
prefer the alcohol variety) to the tank.

A block heater might be nice, but not at the expense of burning
the place down. Home Depot has 10AWG extension cords at what
appears to me to be reasonable prices.


Well I live in Edmonton Alberta. The low tonite is forcast at
-35C . I have a block heater and charger on the battery.

My extention corn runs from the back of the house out across
the sidewalk. I felt the cord.

Nothing feels warm at all. Can I say " Cold as a witches tit".
Click to expand...

I meant to say cord.. It's hard to type with frostbitten fingers.
 
Zipperhead wrote:

In article <101dl7l3kgckd02@corp.supernews.com>, warf@compusmart.ab.ca
says...

In article <QPmdnS6amqMRUovdRVn-uQ@comcast.com>,
bill9north@hotmailDITCHTHIS.com says...

Zipperhead wrote:

Hey...If you drive a Ford you will try anything to get it
started in cold weather.

I do, and in northern Michigan have never had a problem getting
any of them started. Of course I use the recommended oil, 5W30,
and a fresh battery every fall, and regularly add dry gas (I
prefer the alcohol variety) to the tank.

A block heater might be nice, but not at the expense of burning
the place down. Home Depot has 10AWG extension cords at what
appears to me to be reasonable prices.

Well I live in Edmonton Alberta. The low tonite is forcast at
-35C . I have a block heater and charger on the battery.

My extention corn runs from the back of the house out across
the sidewalk. I felt the cord.

Nothing feels warm at all. Can I say " Cold as a witches tit".

I meant to say cord.. It's hard to type with frostbitten fingers.
Click to expand...
You are a good bit colder. Still, with that sort of ambient you
can dump a LOT of heat off an undersized extension cord that
would serve you better in the block heater. It sounds as though
you're running a short cord, so all may be well anyway.

Is Home Depot in Canada yet?
 
In article <lLSdnRjvxK1ofIvdRVn-jA@comcast.com>,
bill9north@hotmailDITCHTHIS.com says...
Zipperhead wrote:

Is Home Depot in Canada yet?
Click to expand...
Sure..Five stores in Edmonton.
 
"Dan Akers" <digikey@webtv.net> wrote in message
Tibur Waltson wrote;
"I use twice the cord of the same type for a1500-
watt heater. The problem is that the cord is hot

Not much info Tibur... What size is the cord?
You know; the "gauge number"?
Click to expand...
Hmmm... please wait...I will go take a look again...

My goodness, I'd been using a #18 extension cord
designed for a 1200-watt heater. The problem is
solved, thanks to all. I had the wrong impression that
#18 AWG/2 is better than #16 . I didn't want to ask
for a while because it sounds sooo "hare-brained." :)

It is doubtful that the extension you are using is of the same
size/material (same size conductor) if the cord temperatures are
appreciably different. It sounds like you're using a #16 or #14 cord.
Click to expand...
The original cord that doesn't heat reads 16 AWG/2
90-degrees C. I have no idea what AWG/2 stands for.
From now on I will use #10 cords.

The #16 would have a dissipation of about 1.3W/ft of twin conductor
cord, making it quite warm (especially if coiled or covered by a rug or
such); the #14 would have about 0.8W/ft. To be safe, I wouldn't use
anything smaller than a #12 extension; the suggestion of #10 is even
better. -Dan Akers
Click to expand...
sci.electronics.basics serves more than
straighten things out - it SAVES LIVES. Thanks!

Tibur
 
Tibur Waltson wrote:
The original cord that doesn't heat reads 16 AWG/2
90-degrees C. I have no idea what AWG/2 stands for.
From now on I will use #10 cords.
Click to expand...
AWG is American Wire Gauge. The /2 means two wires.

--
We now return you to our normally scheduled programming.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
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